How to Start 40 Companies (and Counting)

Speaker 60s - 81.5s

Pushkin PERSON. Where do you see your career in 10 years? What are you doing now to help you get there? The sooner you start enhancing your skills, the sooner you'll be ready. That's why AARP ORG has re-skilling courses in a variety of categories like marketing and management, to help your income live as long as you do.That's right, AARP ORG has a bevy of free skill-building courses for you to choose from, because the step you choose to take today will help you love what you do in the future. That's why the younger you are, the more you need AARP. Learn more at AARP.org slash skills. The most innovative companies are going further with T-Mobile ORG for business. The PGA of America is helping lower scores and elevate fan experiences with AI coaching tools and 5G connected cameras. AAA ORG is getting more drivers back on the road fast with location telematics. And the Las Vegas Grand Prix is powering race day operations with 5G connectivity,giving fans an experience at the speed they deserve. This is accelerating innovation with T-Mobile ORG for business. Take your business further at T-Mobile.com slash now. Hi, this is Wilfredel ORG.

Speaker 081.8s - 116.48s

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off the companies of which you're a founder and a co-founder and stop wherever you get tired?

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I mean, I can try to do that, but that might take some time. Give me a handful. Count off five on your fingers, just for fun.

Speaker 6129.3s - 137s

Sure. Well, Moderna, Momenta, Pure Tech, Sear, Living Proof ORG.

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For a second, I thought you were just going to do the M's, which might have been a while.

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I could. I could do with the A's.

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Robert Langer has founded or co-founded something like 40 companies.

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He is an institute professor at MIT ORG.

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He holds over 1,000 patents,

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and his research has been cited more than 400,000 times. But when he started his career in the 1970s, he didn't seem bound for professional glory. He had a hard time finding a job. He couldn't get funding for his research. And his patent applications kept getting rejected.And I think these two things, his early struggles and his later massive success, are in fact closely connected. Langer PERSON was trying to do something that was deeply and profoundly different than what anybody had done before. Almost nobody understood it. Almost nobody knew what to do with him. And then when his work finally did succeed,it was such a new, powerful discovery that people are still building on it today, half a century later. I'm Jacob Goldstein, and this is What's Your Problem WORK_OF_ART, the show where I talk to people who are trying to make technological progress. Robert Langer PERSON is still working, still doing research, still founding companies, and we talked about some of his current work in the later part of our conversation. But to start, we went back to the mid-1970s, when Langer PERSON got his doctorate in chemical engineering.And he did something that at the time was really unusual. He did a postdoc with a medical school professor, a pediatric surgeon named Judah Folkman PERSON. Langer PERSON's field is bioengineering, basically bringing the tools of engineering to the fields of biology and medicine. And bioengineering is a huge field today, but it barely existed back when Langer started his postdoc with that doctor, Judah Folkman PERSON. And bioengineering was exactly what Judah Folkman needed. Fulkeman PERSON had an idea for a new kind of drug.And this kind of drug was a molecule that was too big and complex to be given as a pill. So Fulkeman PERSON needed somebody who could figure out how to deliver this new kind of drug to patients. As you'll hear, that delivery problem was fundamentally an engineering problem. And when Langer PERSON solved that problem, he created an entirely new way to get medicine to patients. And it proved incredibly useful. Tell me about being an engineer and going off to work in the 1970s in the lab of a physician.

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On the one hand, for me, it was very hard because I had to learn a lot about medical things, and I didn't know very much biology. So that was difficult. But on the other hand, being an engineer, I guess I had a different perspective, you know, that I didn't maybe think the same wayas a clinician or surgeon or a biologist. You know, engineers I didn't maybe think the same way as a clinician or surgeon or biologist. You know, engineers, they solved problems. And that Judah Folkman PERSON, who was my boss at the time, I mean, that's what he wanted. He wanted to see a problem solved. So let's talk specifically about that

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problem. What did you, what did you go to Dr. Folkman PERSON's lab to work on?

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Dr. Folkman PERSON had this idea that if you could stop blood vessels, you could stop cancer. It wasn't, most people didn't think he was right. In fact, he went further. He said that the reason blood vessels come to the tumor is that the tumor makes a chemical signal. He called the tumor angiogenesis factor. And he said that was chemically mediated.And also the idea that he thought about is if that was chemically mediated, maybe stopping it could also be chemically mediated. So my job really, in a way, was to prove that he was right because almost everybody told him he was wrong. And in so doing, isolate the first, you know, blood vessel or angiogenesis inhibitor.

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Uh-huh. And so it's basically that there is this theory that he had that tumors stimulate the growth of new blood vessels. And then if that's true, perhaps you could inhibit the growth of new blood vessels and thereby inhibit the growth of tumors, right? And so you get there, and I'm interested in that inhibition piece, right? Because that seems like that's where you're really in a very direct way bringing your engineering skills to bear on this medical problem.

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So like, talk about that side of it and how you approached it. So what we wanted to do was have a little nanoparticle or microparticle that could deliver different molecules I was isolating, and these were fairly large molecules. So that was really

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the idea. And then, see, could it stop the blood vessels? So this core idea of developing a nanoparticle to deliver a large molecule, basically a complicated drug, is an engineering problem, right? This nanopartic, it's like we've got this drug, call it, that we think might be able to stop tumor growth. But how do we get it to the tumor, right? That is a basic problem that you are coming up against early in your research. And that problem winds up being a big deal, right? And the way you go about solving that problem winds up being a big deal.So tell me about that.

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Well, the nanoparticles and microparticles, really, it's taking molecules, drugs, encapsulating, surrounding them with a lipid or polymer, and delivering it to cells or a patient or an animal.

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And a lipid or a polymer is basically some fat or some plastic?

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Yeah, yeah, lipid is some fat and polymer, some plastic, generally speaking. So, yeah, if you just gave the drug by itself and it wasn't packaged in those particles, it would just get destroyed.

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I mean, so the number one reason you do it is to protect it, you know, otherwise it won't, you know, it'll just get destroyed probably almost immediately.

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So, you know, we asked people who were experts in that area, Nobel Prize WORK_OF_ART winners and others who had done work on, or at least helped on delivery of small molecules. And we asked them about that, but they all told us it wasn't possible. Okay.

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So I spent years in the laboratory experimenting, finding hundreds of different ways to failing hundreds of different times.

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But finally, I was successful. And, you know, we published a paper in Nature in 1976, the journal Nature, and showed for the first time that you could deliver large molecules this way. And we published a paper in science in 1976, showing for the first time that you could stop blood vessels by using approaches like this.

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And as I understand it, even after you published those papers, you met a lot of resistance.

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Yeah, I did. I suppose I met a lot of resistance for a couple ways. First, different people didn't agree with it or didn't believe it or didn't think it was possible. Secondly, my background really wasn't right, I suppose, for the different review sections. I was an engineer, and when we sent the grants to like the National Institutes of Health ORG and places like that, you know, they had medical people or biological people reviewing it and they said, well, what can an engineer, you know, he doesn'tknow anything about biology or oncology. Separately, I met a lot of resistance when I tried to do this, get a job in an engineering department. They said, well, engineers, the chemical engineering department, they said engineers really don't do experimental biology. So I didn't get any faculty positions in chemical engineering department for a very, very long time. I ended up in an nutrition department.

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And so, I mean, this idea of bioengineering that is a big deal now and was very novel then, it feels like you're sort of coming up against this problem of creating a field that doesn't quite exist yet, or at least creating a part of a field that doesn't exist yet, which seems like on the one hand, the opportunity to solve very large problems was clearly there. On the other hand, the kind of institutional structure to allow that to happen was not on your side. Yeah, you're right.

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I mean, there had been people in chemical engineering doing work on what I'd call mathematical modeling, you know, transport of molecules. But experimental stuff, inventing things, yeah, that, and discovering, you know, new molecules, that certainly had not been done, never been done in chemical engineering up until that time. So, so that, so that ended up

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being hard. Is it right that some of your early patent applications around this technology

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were also rejected? Yeah, they were. I mean, the first, the main patent on it got rejected five times in a row. But, you know, sometimes that happens. After that, I think I had one, when we came up with the idea of tissue engineering, I think that got rejected even more. So, anyhow, those things happen.

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And so you get the patents and you end up licensing the technology initially to one or more big companies, right, big pharmaceutical companies. What happens with that?

Speaker 4716.32s - 753.88s

Yeah, well, actually, the hospital did that, the license, because I mean, the patents is my name, but they licensed it. You know, I was very excited about that. They, there were two multi-billion dollar companies, one in animal health, one in human health. You know, so they gave me a consulting fee. They gave me actually a very large grant, which for young professors, you know, terrific. Most importantly, they were going to work on it.And they did work on it for maybe up to a year, but then they just gave up. So I got the grant and the consulting fee, but I didn't get what I wanted most, which was to see the work that we did make a difference in the world.

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Were you surprised when they gave up? What was your response when they gave up?

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I guess I was sad. I don't know that I was surprised. I certainly have seen plenty of places give up before, but it made me sad. I really thought that this was a way of moving things forward, was having companies, you know, take what you published and what you did and develop it. But I was mostly sad.

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So how do you get from there to starting your first company?

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Yeah, well, a good friend of mine, Alex Klebenoff PERSON, he was a professor in that nutrition department. Later, he was a professor in the chemistry department at MIT ORG. He said to me one day after this happened, he said, well, Bob PERSON, we should start our own company. So I thought, yeah, if you're not your own champion, nobody else is going to be. So we did. And I got a number of my students to join that company, and they were very excited about it. Sothat ended up, you know, they weren't going to give up very easily. And so you keep working

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on this original idea of a particle that can deliver a drug, a large molecule drug, basically. And when does it become clear to you that it's going to work?

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Well, actually, for me, I was pretty clear it was going to work when we wrote that early paper in nature.

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I mean, I thought I'd see it with my own eyes. I put certain types of, well, I'm trying to think I explain this.

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I put certain enzymes. Those are all large molecules in these materials. And I had this test that would turn color if the enzymes were coming out. And I've got to see it not work many, many times, hundreds of times. But finally, I did see it work. And I, so I didn't see how this couldn't, you know, so since I saw it with my own eyes, but that didn't mean that other people were going to necessarily believe it, but I did. And, you know, I had people still 10, 15 years later tell me couldn't possibly be right. I mean, very experienced people, but, you know, that's the world.I mean, a lot of times there's skepticism.

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And what was the first drug from that idea that made it to the market, that made it to patients?

Speaker 4893.96s - 915.74s

You know, we had this collaboration with a company called Decatur as a Japanese NORP company, and they had sent people to our lab every year, and we had grants from them, and they created what's called Lupron Depot PRODUCT. And that ultimately did get approved, and still versions of it are widely used today.

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What kind of patients did that treat? What did that drug do?

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It was a way to treat advanced prostate cancer and endometriosis.

Speaker 6923.36s - 928.98s

And was it the anti-angiogenesis? Was it inhibiting the formation of blood vessels, or was it something else?

Speaker 4928.98s - 952.28s

No, no, it was affecting hormones. It was a different hormonal thing. The angiogenesis ones, they are, you know, other people use the assays we've developed and other things that we did and things that they did themselves. And they would ultimately get many drugs approved. But it took many, many years.That didn't take place until 2004.

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Can you just list off some of the conditions, diseases that are treated with this, you know, technology and the offshoots of this technology that you came up with?

Speaker 4963.14s - 985s

Well, prostate cancer andometriosis. I mean, there are treatments for heart diseases, different eye diseases, schizophrenia, opioid addiction, osteoarthritis, diabetes. I mean, I'm sure I'm leaving out a lot, but those are some. Still to come on the show,

Speaker 6985.38s - 1067.5s

how Robert Langer wound up creating 40 companies. Also, the research he's excited about today. You probably think it's too soon to join AARP ORG, right? Well, let's take a minute to talk about it. Where do you see yourself in 15 years? More specifically, your career, your health, your social life?What are you doing now to help you get there? There are tons of ways for you to start preparing today for your future with AARP ORG. That dream job you've dreamt about? Sign up for AARP ORG reskilling courses to help make it a reality. How about that active lifestyle you've only spoken about from the couch? AARP has health tips and wellness tools to keep you moving for years to come.But none of these experiences are without making friends along the way. Connect with your community through AARP ORG volunteer events. So it's safe to say it's never too soon to join AARP. They're here to help your money, health, and happiness live as long as you do. That's why the younger you are, the more you need AARP. Learn more at AARP.org slash wise friend. The most innovative companies are going further with T-Mobile ORG for business.

Speaker 21067.5s - 1098.34s

The PGA of America is helping lower scores and elevate fan experiences with AI coaching tools and 5G-connected cameras. AAA ORG is getting more drivers back on the road fast with location telematics. And the Las Vegas Grand Prix is powering race day operations with 5G connectivity, giving fans an experience at the speed they deserve. This is accelerating innovation with T-Mobile ORG for business. Take your business further at T-Mobile.com ORG slash now.

Speaker 31099.54s - 1104.72s

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Speaker 21104.72s - 1110.48s

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Speaker 31115.12s - 1160.38s

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So after you started that one initial company, you wound up starting or being a co-founder of a lot of companies. I don't have the number in front of me. Is dozens the right order of magnitude? Yeah, 40, 40, 41, something like that.

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Like, how's that happen?

Speaker 61179.46s - 1182.98s

Like, what, how'd that happen? Well.

Speaker 41183.22s - 1184.14s

It's a lot of companies.

Speaker 61184.68s - 1190.48s

Yeah, but it's over, it's over close to a 40-year period. Still, a company a year seems like a lot to me.

Speaker 41190.54s - 1240.52s

I don't know. Yeah. Well, I have a big lab. I have a lot of graduate students. Some of the graduate students would see what I did and both docs, and they wanted to start companies, so we did.I mean, you know, we may have done work in the lab for five or six years, and then when it got to a certain stage, we spun it out. And some people, other people, colleagues of mine, would see that, you know, I had done this, and so they'd come to me and talk to me about companies. So I, you know, so, yeah, we kept doing it. I mean, to me, it's, it's been a great route for taking discoveries in the academic lab and getting them out to the world. As I mentioned, I had a hard time maybe given the stageof the work to get large companies that would do it. So we did it ourselves.

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And when you started your first company, I feel like it was much less common for professors to start companies than it is now. I'm curious sort of culturally, you know, within MIT ORG, within academia, what was that like? Did you get pushback? I think anytime money's involved,

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a lot of people will tell you, I think there's jealousy about it, and people feel you shouldn't be spending your time doing that, even at MIT ORG. So, yeah, I ran into problems when people were thinking about me for promotion. You know, at one point I had a partial chair and they took that away from me. So, yeah, it was discouraging in the beginning.In fact, I'd say when I was in the nutrition department, a lot of people, some people told me that the drug delivery ideas they would never work and I should be looking for a new job.

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Do you feel like you have gained insight into what that moment is or particular elements of that moment when you take something that is basic research, academic research, and decide, okay, this is the moment we're going to take the leap. We're going to start a company. We're going to try and commercialize it. How do you know? Well, I don't think you ever know for sure, but the kinds of

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high-level rules that I've used are generally you have what I'll call as a platform technology, meaning it's almost like a plug-and-play thing. Those drug delivery systems are a good example, right? You could use it for drug A, drug B, drug C. Then I think the next thing is that you've taken it a certain distance, right? You have maybe animal data. You also have a paper, ideally a good journal, like say science or nature. You have a patent or your high likelihood of getting a patent because you've advanceda certain distance. And usually there are people in my lab that want to be involved in it. So those are the kinds of things that inform my thinking about it.

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So what is something right now on the basic research side that you're excited about. What is a big idea that is early that you think holds a lot of promise? Well, I think the tissue engineering work we're

Speaker 41390.78s - 1433.1s

doing holds a lot of promise. I mean, an example that we're doing is we're working with Leeway Sai, who's head of MIT's Pickauer Institute, and I have a wonderful postdoc Alice Stanton PERSON. You know, we're actually creating a brain on a chip. It's not been published yet, but she's been able to convert, you know, like say, we could take your cells and convert it first to iPS cells and then convert each of those depending on what we do to a different brain cell type, six different cell types.She's found a matrix that she can put them on and that really makes them grow and function. And, you know, so that's something I'm excited about. And what,

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when you say put it on a chip, what does that mean? And then what do you do with my brain on a chip?

Speaker 41439.04s - 1459s

Yeah. Well, what I mean by in a chip, it's in vitro. It's not in an animal. It's not in a person. What it means is that you could rather, like you could think about, if you were going to do experiment in a person, I mean, of course, there's a lot you wouldn't be able to find out anyhow because we'd have to take you apart and we're obviously not going to do that. I appreciate that. Yeah, and with

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animals, you know, it's a little bit similar. Here, so what you do with it is you could literally test thousands and thousands of

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do thousands and thousands of experiments and get readouts on them.

Speaker 61474.18s - 1479.56s

So it might someday reduce animal testing, hopefully also reduce human testing,

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and may greatly speed up drug discovery. I mean, there's so many drugs that you'd like to be able to have for brain disease, right? Like for Alzheimer's, for Lugarig PERSON's disease, ALS, for Parkinson's. So I hope someday.

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Brain disease has been famously difficult to treat with drugs, right? It's a very, very hard set of diseases.

Speaker 41499.1s - 1503.5s

Right, because we don't understand it well enough, and the tests are very, very hard to do.

Speaker 21503.72s - 1505.38s

So something like this, if it truly ends up working well, are very, very hard to do. So something like this,

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if it truly ends up working well, you know, could change that someday. But that's an example

Speaker 61511.64s - 1520.58s

of something I'm excited about. As you said, it's like it's a platform, right? Presumably, if you could do brain cells, you could do different kinds of cells. It could be a way to do

Speaker 41520.58s - 1565.5s

lots of testing. What we've done, yeah, what we've put, in this case, we have six different brain cell types in vitro. We have our working on other cell types, too. We have a gastrointestinal track on a chip. We've had a heart on a chip. And, of course, it's not just putting them on chip. Someday, you could use it for repairing tissues.You know, you could maybe, I mean, in fact, Lauren Nicholson, one of my former postdoc, she runs a company that's making new blood vessels that's been used on patients in the Ukraine GPE. Others have used, made artificial skin for burn victims or patients with diabetic skin ulcers. And people are trying to make new cartilage, all kinds of tissues. So, so yeah, so that's, that is a big, you know, that's an exciting area.

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And that tissue engineering side? I mean, does that go back to a kind of similar origin story? I know there was sort of early tissue engineering work that you did as well. What was that work?

Speaker 41576.86s - 1621.88s

Yeah, well, they are, one of the people I got to meet at Children's Hospital is Jay Vacante PERSON. He was a pediatric surgeon, still is, and he was treating patients with liver failure. And one day he came to see me, said, Bob PERSON, you know, I do all these transplants. Would it ever be possible to make a liver from scratch? And he and I brainstormed and came up with a way that we hope might do that with polymer scaffolds and cells. And so we've continued on working together and separately and different ways to make this happen. But that started probably over 40 years ago,and that certainly was the basis for a lot of these things. So we can't synthesize livers yet,

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but what are some of the clinical applications that have been found

Speaker 41625.64s - 1667.02s

to some of the research you did there? Well, you can make artificial skin for burn victims. It looks like we'll be able to make blood vessels. I mean, there have been clinical trials on a variety of things ranging from new spinal cord repaired, hearing loss, you know, a lot of different things. But I think ultimately it's unlimited. You know, you could, a lot of different things. But I think ultimately it's unlimited. You know, you could theoretically use approaches like this. If you understand the right cells, the right signals, the right biology, and the right engineering, I don't see that there's necessarily any limit to what you could use it for.But people, we need to understand it more. We'll be back in a minute with the lightning round.

Speaker 61675.68s - 1740.36s

You probably think it's too soon to join AARP ORG, right? Well, let's take a minute to talk about it. Where do you see yourself in 15 years? More specifically, your career, your health, your social life. What are you doing now to help you get there? There are tons of ways for you to start preparing today for your future with AARP ORG.That dream job you've dreamt about? Sign up for AARP ORG reskilling courses to help make it a reality. How about that active lifestyle you've only spoken about from the couch? AARP has health tips and wellness tools to keep you moving for years to come. But none of these experiences are without making friends along the way. Connect with your community through AARP ORG volunteer events.So it's safe to say it's never too soon to join AARP ORG. They're here to help your money, health, and happiness live as long as you do. That's why the younger you are, the more you need AARP. Learn more at AARP.org ORG slash wise friend. The most innovative companies are going further

Speaker 21740.36s - 1772.74s

with T-Mobile for business. The PGA of America is helping lower scores and elevate fan experiences with AI coaching tools and 5G connected cameras. AAA ORG is getting more drivers back on the road fast with location telematics.And the Las Vegas Grand Prix EVENT is powering Race Day operations with 5G connectivity, giving fans and experience at the speed they deserve. This is accelerating innovation with T-Mobile ORG forbusiness. Take your business further at T-Mobile.com slash now.

Speaker 31773.92s - 1840.48s

Musora ORG is your access to online music lessons for guitar, piano, drums, and singing. This is your chance to reignite some old musical passions or pick up an instrument for the first time. Connect with more than 100of the world's best teachers and musicians. You'll get seven days totally free to try it out, and then it's just $30 a month, less than a single private lesson. I mean, why do we do broken record? Not just because we love hearing from great musicians.We do it because we think that there is something beautiful about the appreciation of music. Don't you think we need more of that in our lives these days? That's the mission of Musora ORG, to inspire, educate, and connect musicians. Enjoy unlimited personal support, weekly live streams, student lesson plans. It's like having a personal music teacher only much, much better. Just go to musora.com, m-us-o-a-com to start a new musical journey today.I want to finish, we're almost done, I appreciate your time.

Speaker 61840.58s - 1852.36s

I want to finish with the lightning round, which is just some quicker, kind of more random, maybe occasionally silly questions. Who is one engineer from history who you wish more

Speaker 41852.36s - 1859.66s

people knew about? Boy. Well, I suppose a lot of people don't realize maybe that Leonardo

Speaker 61859.66s - 1866.46s

Da Vinci was a very good engineer. Very good. What is some of your favorite engineering work of Leonardo PERSON's?

Speaker 41867.36s - 1877.46s

Well, I mean, he did all kinds of things. He looked at hearts. He looked at, you know, water flow. I mean, he did a lot, not just art.

Speaker 61879.26s - 1881.1s

Who is the best teacher you ever had?

Speaker 41885.12s - 1887.04s

Maybe George Shealy at Cornell ORG.

Speaker 61888.18s - 1889.96s

What about him made him such a good teacher?

Speaker 41890.72s - 1893.98s

Well, first, he cared a lot, and he explained things well.

Speaker 61894.38s - 1896.88s

But I think caring a lot, that means a lot.

Speaker 41898.38s - 1902.84s

You're also a magician, and I'm curious if there are any skills from close-up magic

Speaker 61902.84s - 1905.56s

that have been helpful to you in your day job.

Speaker 41905.94s - 1913.56s

You know, the one thing that does make a difference with magic is presentation.

Speaker 61914.6s - 1920.52s

So, you know, if you give, so what I learn in magic, if I make a mistake, sometimes, of course, you make it deliberately.

Speaker 41921.24s - 1942.48s

But if I made a mistake, you know, it's part of the show. You don't get upset. You just, you know, you just go with the flow. And what I'd say is if I made a mistake in the talk, same thing. You know, it's like you don't get flustered. You just say, you just keep going. And that does

Speaker 61942.48s - 1962.34s

make a difference. So your research also helped to create, as I understand it, a line of hair care products called Living Proof. Jennifer Aniston PERSON, who I will say had great hair before the company started, is involved in that company. And so I'm curious, what's your favorite living proof product,

Speaker 41962.64s - 1996.08s

and are you using it right now? Well, so I would say, you know, one of the living proof products is called Ph.D. And it stands for Perfect Hair Day. Oh, Perfect Hair Day. Okay. Are you using it right now? So I use the shampoos. Okay. But, gee, my wife and my daughter and lots of people use lots of the products.But I basically use it in a shampoo. Every so often when my hair gets longer, I have just a spray that I put on that doesn't make it frizz up so much. Great.

Speaker 61996.52s - 1998.54s

Is there anything else you think we should talk about?

Speaker 42000.76s - 2046.9s

Well, the only other thing I'd say that we've done that we really didn't touch on is, is we're doing a lot of work with the Gates Foundation ORG to help the developing world. And I'm excited about that as well. I mean, they've been a big supporter of our lab, and he's done a terrific job in terms of helping. And I think the work is leading to new kinds of nutrition, new kinds of oral delivery that could last much longer than just a day can lead, it's also leading to what wecall self-boosting injections so you wouldn't have to come back for a second shot. So I think it's leading to a lot of things that I hope will someday help a lot of people, whether, you know, not only in the developing world, but everyone in the world, period.

Speaker 62047.74s - 2055.26s

Of those technologies that you just listed, is any one of them particularly, you know, farther along in development?

Speaker 42055.6s - 2071.64s

Well, several of them are already. I mean, the pills that you can swallow orally are in, that lasts for a week or a month. They're in phase three clinical trials. There's a company Lindra, that Geotroversa ORG and I helped start. That's probably the most advanced.

Speaker 62072.1s - 2077.44s

Is that for anti-malarials or what is the first application there? The most advanced application

Speaker 42077.44s - 2082.08s

is schizophrenia. It's in phase three trial. It is in clinical trials for malaria too.

Speaker 62082.56s - 2089.26s

Okay. But that's like in phase one. So presumably that would be a big deal because drug adherence is always a problem.

Speaker 42089.44s - 2091s

People very often don't take their drugs.

Speaker 62091.16s - 2094.38s

Presumably people who are mentally ill might have more trouble with adherence.

Speaker 42094.44s - 2098.66s

So if you could have a pill once a week instead of every day, that would be a very large improvement.

Speaker 62098.66s - 2098.9s

Yeah.

Speaker 42099.02s - 2114.78s

And also once a month, you know, we've been working on two, you know, like a once a month birth control pill. And yeah, so all those things, you know, that's moving forward. Robert Langer is an institute professor at MIT ORG.

Speaker 62115.98s - 2145.16s

Today's show was produced by Gabriel Hunter Chang PERSON. It was edited by Lydia Jean Cott and engineered by Sarah Brugier PERSON. You can email us at problem at pushkin.fm. I'm Jacob Goldstein and we'll be back next week with another episode of What's Your Problem WORK_OF_ART? We feel way more competent and secure in our finances. And with that comes a sense of freedom. Does money stress you out? Let FASID ORG flip your financial chaos into clarity.

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Speaker 22207s - 2242.78s

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