Full Show (T-Wolves up 2-0 on Nuggets, Ty Lue is top Lakers HC candidate, Pacers robbed vs Knicks?)

Speaker 30s - 19.62s

Good morning. It is time to skip the BS. It's time for undisputed. It's time to buckle up and dive deep into NBA shock and controversy with Keith Sean Johnson and FS1 NBA insider Rick Hooker. Morning gentlemen. Good morning. How are you? What's happening? We kind of missed you a little bit yesterday.

Speaker 219.84s - 32.48s

Yeah, I was going to have fun. A little bit with Paul, but I had to go to Arkansas because of the Minnesota situation. Oh, yeah? You know, game one. I haven't even gotten game two yet. We'll get that.

Speaker 332.58s - 116.8s

We'll get back to that tomorrow. But right now, let's do this. And by the way, we will get the Nuggets on Life Support. Man, man saying don't call him Jordan and Tyloos still speculated as a potential next Lakers coach and Wimby taking over the league and Clippers running it back, running it right in the ground, and I don't know, Mavs thunder.But first up, Knicks Pacers. Would you believe the Pacers bench outscored the Knicks bench 46 to 3 last night? Think about that. 46 to 3 bench points. Yet the Knicks prevail by giving the visiting Pacers a shot of Nova Cain in the fourth quarter, the Villanova Knicks. Jalen Brunson, of course, and Josh Hart, Dante DiVincenzo, came up big in the fourth,which the Knicks won 39 to 30, which gave the Knicks a 121 to 117, game one win. It was three-man quality in the fourth over nine-man quantity over four quarters. Still, it came down to two controversial plays. Refs admitted after the game, they blew a kick ball call with 52 seconds left. It should have been a Jalen Brunson turnover. And then there was that moving screen called on Miles Turner with 12.7 seconds left.And the Pacers with the ball down only one. So, Rick, please tip us off. Did the Pacers get robbed? No, they did not.

Speaker 5116.88s - 121.24s

By the way, you guys may not know. Skip was pretty darn good writer in his day.

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Man, that intro was something.

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Thank you.

Speaker 4123.12s - 123.48s

I appreciate it.

Speaker 0123.48s - 124.24s

That was on the money.

Speaker 3124.34s - 152.36s

Thank you. He's on deadline, too. You know how that goes. 100%. No, they did not, they did not get robbed. They got out executed. And I was actually surprised because in looking at, and you mentioned it, the minutes and the difference in the benches, the Indiana Pacers and the final minutes of that game looked like the fresher team to me. And yet it was Jalen Brunson against the world getting it done while Tyrese Halliburton.

Speaker 5152.54s - 163.8s

One thing we love about him is he plays fast and loose and easy. And he played fast and loose and easy in the final minutes of that game and in the fourth quarter.

Speaker 3163.9s - 173.96s

I'm looking at Skor-Dooch in terms of of points. Zero. Yeah. Zero assists. Didn't get anything done in the fourth quarter

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had three turnovers in the fourth quarter, including a couple at the end and could have had a

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fourth one on a cross-court pass. And I was like, wow, what's he thinking, right? And then

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meanwhile, you have Jalen Brunson,

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who is just a marvel. He's playing against multiple defenders, guys who have greater length

Speaker 5194.26s - 218.48s

and size. The Knicks don't run anything complicated. It's basically give Jalen the ball, and let's see if you can get something. And indeed he did time and time again. I don't know if it's a recipe that is going to work over the long term. But in this game in particular, no, this was not the Pacers getting a bad whistle. This was the Pacers not finishing the job.

Speaker 2221.04s - 270.5s

And that's what it always comes down to, right, the fourth quarter. We look at the first three quarters and we look at what guys do statistically, but the fourth quarter in the NBA seems to be where you're meat and potatoes that. When you allow a guy to score 21 points, get to the bucket at will, at ease, better yet, no matter how manydifferent defenders you're throwing at him, the defenders you're throwing at him is slightly taller, not as quick. They don't have the same sort of pace as him and he's able to just do things at will. And I know going into this series, everybody said, hey, they don't run deep into their rotation.They're going to give you six, seven men. Meanwhile, you got Indiana that's up and down the court. They're going to go nine deep. It doesn't matter, though. It doesn't matter because this is something that they've been doing all year long. They've been going six, seven deep all year long.So when you start to look at them wearing down in the end, they just turn to their main guy.

Speaker 1270.9s - 288.36s

Hasn't mattered yet. Well, but all we can talk about right now, Rick, is today. We can't worry about tomorrow. We got to worry about today and what happened last night, right? You can say, we can say, oh, they can wear down over time. Well, they got to get through this series to even worry about the next series.

Speaker 5288.48s - 320.06s

But I could see it being an issue in this series when you're talking about the Pacers' second fastest pace of anybody in the league, all that depth. And again, Skip, Jalen Brunson is the guy. And it's not even like, first of all, undersized. And I disagree with you. I think Nemhart, I think those guys are just as quick. Jalen Brunson's ability to change direction and just find the airspace to get his shot off is the difference maker.He's not blowing by guys.

Speaker 2320.06s - 330.08s

But if I could get my space, because I'm quicker than you to get to my spot and get my airspace, that tells me right there. Your length is not affecting me at all.

Speaker 5330.38s - 351.16s

I think it's just his understanding of what his spots are and the threat of him being able to finish multiple ways at the rim, pull up, hit the mid-range, and hit the three. If you just give me a little bit of a window, it's not Steph Curry, which is what makes it so remarkable because Steph is playing off the ball and he's

Speaker 0351.16s - 357.08s

got Draymond finding him and he gets easy stuff here and there. Jalen gets nothing easy.

Speaker 3357.18s - 362.96s

Nothing. And that's where I just, over the course, you say he doesn't get anything easy, Rick?

Speaker 0363.06s - 366.3s

Yeah. He gets it easy because he creates it for himself to make it easy.

Speaker 5366.4s - 371.12s

He does, but he's got to work really hard to be able to get that.

Speaker 3371.18s - 374.86s

And if I'm throwing Andrew Nemhart at him, and I'm throwing T.J. McConnell at him,

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and he's got to guard them at the other end.

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And you've got to do that for 48 minutes.

Speaker 3380.02s - 383.26s

Like, and he literally, for him, practically 48 minutes.

Speaker 2383.46s - 383.66s

Yeah.

Speaker 3383.96s - 391.34s

I just question if this, the longer this series goes, the more I question whether they can sustain them.

Speaker 5391.34s - 395.32s

But this is the same conversation to a degree that we had in the Sixers series.

Speaker 2395.88s - 401.88s

Can Jaylon Brunson by himself do these sort of things because they're going to throw different bodies at him, yada, yada, yada.

Speaker 5402.12s - 412.16s

And then all of a sudden, he's in the second round. Without question. But the Sixers, because of Joel M.B., are going to play slower than the paces there.

Speaker 1412.26s - 416.76s

They're going to take the ball out, and they're going to come right back at you over and over and over again.

Speaker 0416.84s - 426.38s

And they have an advantage in depth and length. And I just, I look, I know that this is the job that Rick, this is the strategy that Rick Carlisle is employing.

Speaker 3426.54s - 488.42s

He's like, I know Tom Thibodeau. Tom, Tom is not going to change. No, he's not. So, I said yesterday, I get tired of watching Jaylen Brunson dribble the basketball because he dribbles the air out of it and it works. Maybe he bores you to death, but he just keeps dribbling and dribbling. His usage rate last night was 35%.Josh Hart and DeVincenzo were 19%. So he's just going to have the ball in his hands most of the time. Stop it. And what's that? You've got to stop it. Stop it.And, yeah, he's got some NFL in him. He's got some fullback in him. He plays strong and stout because I don't know how tall he is. They list him at 6-2, maybe 6-1-ish, maybe. He's Chris Paul 6-2. Yeah, that. And yet, Kishan, he is bouncing people off him. He's using elbows and shoulders, and he is creating space with his strength and his step back and fall away.And I don't know how he gets his shot off. Half the time, I think that's blocked.

Speaker 2489.4s - 489.58s

And it goes in.

Speaker 0490.36s - 490.84s

Create the space. He does.

Speaker 2491.08s - 552.34s

It's beautiful to watch in the end if you can just hang with the dribble, dribble, dribble, dribble, dribble, dribble, dribble, dribble, dribble. All right, do not underestimate what Josh Hart did last night because look what he gave you. He gave you 24 points and 13 rebounds and 8 assists. That's a big time basketball game to me. So don't tell me he didn't have any help. And he did that on 9 of 13 shots.And don't tell me that DeVincenzo, once called the Michael Jordan of Delaware when he was in high school, can't play to some degree because that shot he made with, what was the three-point shot that he made with 40 seconds left, that's the shot of the night because it's tied, and he makes it to go up three, and that's what they hung on to. He is not afraid of the moment, and he had 25 points and made five out of nine, three.So don't discount those two. And now we get back to what I told Paul Pierce yesterday again. You weren't here, but we went back and forth. He loves the Pacers and this. I like the Knicks. And I said, who's their dog? Who's their

Speaker 3552.34s - 605.64s

closer? Who do you fear? Who's going to say that's enough? Who's going to say, I got this for the Indiana Pacers because I'm not sure yet. I thought maybe mid-year it was Tyrese Halliburton. He is, he was questionable last night with a back spasm. And when he did his between-quarters interview, he's wearing that strap-around back brace. I don't know.But to Rick's point, man, when you play nine and a half minutes of the fourth quarter and you give me bubkus, as you say, like no assists and no points, you don't even take a shot. You take one shot in the whole second half. Okay, it's not good enough. And if you can't play, let little T.J. play because T.J. can play. Again, I'm rooting against the Pacers last night. And I feared TJ a lot more than I feared Tyrese because when T.J. came in, he made nine out of 16 shots.He made things happen.

Speaker 2607.54s - 608.58s

But it's hard to take a super. No, I know.

Speaker 3610.22s - 655.72s

A star player is hard. I don't blame. To allow a role player. And they won't. Yeah, it's just hard. It's hard to do. Even though he had a better game.He had a much better game. He had 22 minutes a run last night. And every second counted because he was a plus nine and Tyrese wound up a minus 12. Okay. So the point is it did come down to these two plays. So let's take them one at a time.The kickball play, I don't even know. I don't know how they missed it because it clearly wasn't even close to being kicked. It wasn't like you look at the replay and say, boy, that's, I'm not, that's too close for the eye to tell. They just flat out swung and missed on it. Yeah, it's a fan. Here it is.The quote-unquote kickball play, Jalen gets very careless with the basketball.

Speaker 5656.34s - 657.12s

And he did there.

Speaker 3657.3s - 662.54s

Yeah, I will say the referee who called it, his angle is really bad.

Speaker 5662.54s - 665.96s

Yeah. Because he's behind Neesmith on that.

Speaker 0666.44s - 669.5s

But he called something that he technically did not see.

Speaker 2669.5s - 681.32s

It looked like it hit his hand originally. Because his hand, his right hand is kind of floating around.

Speaker 5681.86s - 684.74s

Well, you also have the ricochet of the ball. It's moving one direction.

Speaker 2684.88s - 689.34s

Suddenly it's going this way. And Neesmith is running in that direction.

Speaker 4689.34s - 694.58s

So it was by deduction rather than observation that he made that call.

Speaker 3694.68s - 717.34s

And he guessed wrong. Yeah. Okay. Now we get down to the Miles Turner moving screen. And by the letter of the law, he, to me, is moving. Do you make that call at that moment in that game?Because it's 12 seconds left, and they are down one point. And so this is for the game right here. And you are moving slightly, and does Devin Shenzzo sell it and flop? Yeah.

Speaker 1717.46s - 721.72s

That's such a – that – I've seen that 30 times in the game.

Speaker 2721.8s - 722.02s

Okay.

Speaker 3722.3s - 724.86s

But is it okay to call it then?

Speaker 2724.86s - 725.86s

No, you don't call. You just play basketball. Oh, I see what you mean. Yeah. I've seen that 30 times in the game. Okay. But is it okay to call it then? No, you don't call.

Speaker 3725.92s - 726.92s

You just play basketball.

Speaker 2727.18s - 727.94s

Oh, I see what you mean.

Speaker 3727.94s - 728.94s

Yeah, I've seen that same screen.

Speaker 2728.94s - 730.46s

I thought you said it's been called 30 times.

Speaker 3730.46s - 732.66s

No, I've seen that same screen and you have two.

Speaker 2733.08s - 734.16s

30 times in the game.

Speaker 3734.28s - 734.34s

Yeah.

Speaker 2734.6s - 738s

The one distinction is he's not moving laterally.

Speaker 3738.32s - 739.56s

He's moving forward.

Speaker 5740.22s - 742.42s

And that's where technically they're going to call.

Speaker 2743.22s - 743.58s

Understood.

Speaker 5743.64s - 752.26s

The biggest issue that I have with it is that on a previous call, Dante was upset because he thought he got flopped on.

Speaker 3752.46s - 756.44s

And I know he went into that play thinking, oh, you're going to call flops?

Speaker 2756.76s - 764.9s

I'm going to get you to call another one because otherwise I got a real issue that you called the one flop and you're not calling this one.

Speaker 4765.02s - 767.36s

So that it was premeditated on this part.

Speaker 0767.36s - 767.86s

That's top.

Speaker 4767.96s - 768.8s

That's such a flop.

Speaker 3769.52s - 771.6s

That's a belief.

Speaker 4771.92s - 772.32s

Understood.

Speaker 0772.56s - 773.52s

He barely texted.

Speaker 4773.82s - 775.34s

But Dante was the same way.

Speaker 3775.4s - 776.22s

No, no, true.

Speaker 4776.28s - 777.08s

They're both flops.

Speaker 0777.62s - 778.18s

No, true.

Speaker 2778.88s - 780.26s

And that's the issue that I have.

Speaker 5780.4s - 783.82s

So, Kishon, I think you are saying that the Pacers got robbed.

Speaker 2785.12s - 786.54s

I believe.

Speaker 5786.54s - 792.7s

Because if you make those two calls the way they should have been made in your eyes, the Pacers have two more shots to win the game.

Speaker 3792.8s - 794.98s

I wouldn't have called it if I was the ref.

Speaker 5795.28s - 796.58s

I wouldn't have called it.

Speaker 3796.98s - 805.7s

Because although he's slightly moving, his momentum in being able to brace yourself, you're going to move.

Speaker 2805.82s - 813.66s

He's not a statue. He's going to move slightly when he's getting to his spot, embracing himself for the collision. He's going to move something.

Speaker 3813.76s - 815.82s

Okay, but you can't move your feet.

Speaker 2816.1s - 816.76s

But you can't.

Speaker 3816.84s - 819.44s

I understand that, but you're going to move something.

Speaker 2819.68s - 824.52s

Yeah, but by the letter of the law, he is slightly moving to his right.

Speaker 3824.78s - 826.78s

Yeah, so don't just ignore it.

Speaker 2826.9s - 829.32s

It does get ignored a good bit.

Speaker 3829.32s - 843.02s

And I must admit, I was shocked they blew that whistle at that moment. Especially because it essentially decided the game. It did. I mean, I don't know that Indiana would have scored, but they didn't get a chance.

Speaker 1843.1s - 845.22s

I mean, you got 12 seconds to go.

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And you're sending them to the free throw.

Speaker 1848.64s - 848.84s

Yeah.

Speaker 3849.1s - 849.34s

Yeah.

Speaker 1849.68s - 851.94s

So you would think that they probably would score.

Speaker 2853.08s - 854.3s

They've been scoring all night.

Speaker 1854.42s - 859.08s

In fact, up to the 10-minute mark of that game, I thought the Knicks had no shot

Speaker 2859.08s - 864.1s

because they could not stop the Pacers from making shots, all of them.

Speaker 1864.1s - 865.1s

But you also got to realize you're in New York. They could not stop the Pacers from making shots. All of them. It was all of them.

Speaker 2865.3s - 868.78s

You also got to realize you're in New York.

Speaker 3868.94s - 870.9s

You're not in Sacramento.

Speaker 5871.46s - 872.12s

You're in New York.

Speaker 2872.82s - 881.14s

And for referees sometimes, that environment would force them to blow the whistle,

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even though they probably shouldn't.

Speaker 2883.06s - 884.5s

There are a lot of celebrities in the front row.

Speaker 3884.5s - 885.56s

It's in New York.

Speaker 5885.76s - 888.04s

It's a different, you know, different beast.

Speaker 2888.34s - 888.54s

Right.

Speaker 3889.54s - 893.78s

Intimidation, whether you believe it or not, could factor into a decision being made.

Speaker 2893.82s - 897.08s

And this is the feel-good story of the NBA season.

Speaker 1897.26s - 897.58s

Yeah.

Speaker 2897.68s - 899.68s

So all of a sudden, all that transpired.

Speaker 3899.68s - 902.98s

They don't want to see the Pacers play against the Celtics.

Speaker 2903.18s - 907.58s

They'd rather see the Celtics and the Knicks play because, hey, guess what?

Speaker 3908.08s - 910.36s

Everybody in the city's going to be watching.

Speaker 5910.36s - 913.82s

Are we going conspiracy theory now with the league?

Speaker 2913.82s - 939.04s

Well, I'm going always feel that way when something like this happens, where you got these two things at the end of a game going against Indy and for the Knicks in New York. In New York. Not in Indiana, but in New York. Who would you rather see play? I know you don't want to say it, but I'll say it for you.Boston and the Knicks.

Speaker 5939.58s - 972.5s

You don't want to see Indy and the Knicks. I pick the Knicks to win this series and as a dark horse to go to the finals. And Skip makes a great point about, like, who's your closer with Indiana? That said, the way the Pacers play and the dynamic way they play and Tyrese Halliburton, I mean, we've had series with the Indiana Pacers. They're a regal enough franchise that, sure, market-wise, you want New York.

Speaker 2972.5s - 974.86s

I do want to clarify.

Speaker 0975.06s - 988.46s

Like I said, I said that they go to the free throw line. They got possession. Possession. And the Knicks did. The Knicks got possession. And then Rick Carlisle had to challenge, which then took his last time out.

Speaker 4988.46s - 988.72s

It did.

Speaker 3989.12s - 993.58s

Because he knew that they're up to, they got the ball, 12 seconds left.

Speaker 4994.02s - 1001.24s

The game's essentially over if we don't get this call overturned. As a result, that was his last time out. They need to change their rule, by the way.

Speaker 21001.74s - 1006.64s

I agree. They need to change you like the NFL. If you lose, you lose your time out. If you win, you keep by the way. I agree. They need to change you. I agree. Like the NFL. If you lose, you lose your time out.

Speaker 31006.96s - 1014.98s

If you win, you keep your timeout. I agree. And I think they need to change the rule whereby you cannot challenge the kicked ball.

Speaker 41015.22s - 1026.12s

Yes. Why not? I mean, it's just like any other play. It's a judgment call. You see it or you don't. Why can't you then review it?

Speaker 51026.2s - 1036.1s

Yeah. Well, I think that the idea is that if the ball actually hits the foot, that is a pure judgment call as whether it's intentional or not.

Speaker 21036.22s - 1037s

But you can tell.

Speaker 31037.3s - 1039.66s

But in this case, it was not kicked.

Speaker 21039.66s - 1053.1s

It was not. But you can tell when somebody is kicking the ball versus somebody bouncing it off one's leg. Even though my motions is my leg is moving, kickball is I'm putting my leg out. That's kickball.

Speaker 51053.6s - 1057.78s

That's kickball. But to your point, like, is my foot moving?

Speaker 21058.14s - 1075.8s

No, but I'm not intentionally. Did I move my foot and then it hits it? I mean, it becomes a very much a judgment call. This is just in a completely different category because he actually didn't kick the ball. But like Skip said, if I could go review that, I can now see, oh, he didn't kick the ball. Right, right. Go review it.

Speaker 51076.04s - 1094.16s

Understood. I think when they, when they created the rule, it was with the thought that we're never going to call a kicked ball when it wasn't kicked. It was just a matter of whether it was intentionally kicked or not, and we don't want to have to walk into having that judged.

Speaker 31094.34s - 1153.64s

All right. So your friend Paul Pearson and I have a bet on this. He's got Pacers. I got Knicks. And with nine minutes left in this game, 10-ish is about 10 minutes left. The Pacers go up nine points.And I thought, I'm cooked, man. I got no shot. They were making everything they looked at, and it felt like the Knicks couldn't stop anything because they got too many weapons. They don't have the weapon, but at that point, it felt like everybody was involved. And then Jalen Brunson starts to get careless with the basketball. And he should have had four fourth quarter turnovers.He did have three. The kickball would have been the fourth one, quote unquote, kick ball. I'm going to show you over the last minute 50 of this game what Jalen Brunson did and got away with, which means this is all maybe meant to be where they're just, they're riding the magic carpet right now. I'm going to show you Jalen Brunson. This is a minute 50 left, and he loses the basketball.That's usually a losing play in a tight game.

Speaker 41154.06s - 1155.88s

Then here's the kickball play.

Speaker 31155.98s - 1201.84s

And that's just a bad, it's a bad pass. I mean, it should have been a turnover on Jalen. And then he gets a, he got kind of trapped on the sideline. Then he tried to bounce it off Halliburton, and then it went right back to him out of bounds. But it was a turnover on Jalen. Those three happened in the last minute and 50 of the game, and he had another one at 748.Well, it's hard to overcome that unless you're just getting every break, and they needed every break that they got. They got the quote-on-quick-ball, and they got the Miles Turner. Without those two things, we probably have a different conversation right now. But right now, it is meant to be for the Knicks. They have that kind of momentum at home.And for the sake of the league, I hope it continues. For the sake of me versus Paul Pierce, I hope it continues.

Speaker 11202.18s - 1204.28s

You think go back to the Sixers series.

Speaker 31204.44s - 1208.76s

If you really want a conspiracy theory, just go back to the Sixers series and look at what

Speaker 21208.76s - 1219.46s

happened at times at home for them against the Sixers. Just look at that. And then they come out, Rick, they come out, you know, with a two-minute report or whatever it is, and they go, oh, well, yeah, we missed that.

Speaker 51219.56s - 1238.66s

Yeah, yeah, we missed that. But I would say the same thing in that series, in that Philadelphia had the opportunity to make the plays to win the game. And yes, they got a tough whistle, and Jalen had all those turnovers. He did. The Pacers didn't exploit those turnovers. Well, neither did the Sixers at times.

Speaker 21238.8s - 1239.88s

They didn't take advantage of it.

Speaker 51240.12s - 1245.62s

But, Rick, even though they didn't take advantage of it, you can't sit here and tell me.

Speaker 21246.4s - 1251.12s

It just happens that in this building... You know what?

Speaker 51251.52s - 1283.68s

If it was, if the Knicks weren't the number two seat, if they hadn't proved over the course of the season that they were the better team. And it happens with players. It happens with teams. You get the benefit of the doubt. I understand. And so if it was they're the seventh seedor they're the lower seat and they're getting these calls, I'd say I might be willing to go, okay, what's going on here? I'm like this with Austin Reeves. How is he getting so much respectfrom the officials? He's an

Speaker 41283.68s - 1289.7s

undrafted, nice player and he gets a great whistle.

Speaker 21290.06s - 1291.38s

No, he's a likable guy.

Speaker 41292.38s - 1297.64s

So, okay, do I think there was a memo sent out? The Knicks are going to go to the next round?

Speaker 21297.8s - 1303.28s

No, but is it subliminal in the restaurant? I don't need a memo to know. I'm in the garden.

Speaker 31303.4s - 1305.4s

I can't believe we're having this conversation. I'm in the garden. I can't need a memo to know. Yeah. I'm in the garden. I can't believe we're having this conversation. I'm in the garden.

Speaker 21306.16s - 1306.74s

I can't.

Speaker 31306.9s - 1307.7s

I can't believe.

Speaker 51308.78s - 1322.86s

The pressure, Rick, of if this team was not the number two seed and they was something else, let's say they was the six seed, it probably would be a different conversation.

Speaker 31323.46s - 1325.86s

Or if this was, because they would be in indie for game one and two. So it probably would be a different conversation. Or if this was, because they would be in

Speaker 51325.86s - 1331.98s

indie for game one and two, so it probably would be a different conversation. They're at home,

Speaker 31332.4s - 1337.16s

the same way they were at home with the Sixers. All I'm saying to you, now the Pacers have to win.

Speaker 21338.08s - 1343.88s

All I'm saying to you is, hey, it's okay. Because as much as I like Indy and Halliburton and

Speaker 31343.88s - 1345.46s

No, it's not okay.

Speaker 21345.7s - 1349.58s

You're suggesting that New York should win.

Speaker 01349.78s - 1350.44s

Oh, I'm 100%.

Speaker 21350.44s - 1353.22s

Because it's better for the ratings.

Speaker 01353.44s - 1358.54s

So you don't think that the people on Park Avenue, I believe that's what the office is at,

Speaker 41359.06s - 1362.98s

they would don't want to see the Boston Celtics.

Speaker 01363.12s - 1364.66s

I'm sure they have a preference.

Speaker 21364.86s - 1365.1s

Okay. No doubt. But to suggest that there.ics. I'm sure they have a preference. Okay.

Speaker 41365.24s - 1365.84s

No doubt.

Speaker 51365.9s - 1368.76s

But to suggest that they're intentionally.

Speaker 21369.48s - 1373.62s

I'm going to suggest that sometimes, as you say, you want to use benefit of the doubt?

Speaker 51373.7s - 1381.7s

We can use benefit of the doubt to make it sound better. That sometimes with certain franchises, you know, you just all of a sudden I see him.

Speaker 31381.7s - 1383.82s

There's no memo to this.

Speaker 21383.98s - 1394.76s

I don't need that. I don't need a memo. The rest will just getting caught up in the emotion of the moment. Exactly. I don't need a memo to know that I got to walk the streets of New York at some point in my life.

Speaker 51394.76s - 1403.36s

I agree. Okay, but there's a distinction there of getting caught up in the home crowd and Madison Square Garden having a special vibe.

Speaker 21403.48s - 1404.02s

It does.

Speaker 01404.18s - 1410.46s

As a referee and saying, you know what, the ratings are better if New York's there rather than Indiana.

Speaker 21410.7s - 1420.32s

So we're going to tilt that. That's intentional in a way as opposed to a huge reaction to a certain atmosphere. However, you want to couch it and put it out in the middle of the table,

Speaker 51420.78s - 1427.02s

I'm just here to say that it's human nature and these referees

Speaker 21427.02s - 1432.52s

are human that when you're in the garden and you understand the magnitude of what's happening

Speaker 51432.52s - 1447.28s

right now. Be careful. You're on a right path there and you're about to take a turn. Be careful about what? Because if you're saying it's just a human, it's human nature to have the home crowd tilt you in a certain direction. That's one thing.

Speaker 21447.28s - 1450.86s

The home crowd in New York, though, wait. Only I'm talking about in New York.

Speaker 51451.04s - 1465.6s

I'm not talking about the home crowd in Sacramento. I'm not talking about the home crowd in Dallas. I'm just talking about in New York right now, a team that hadn't been to the finals since like 2000 or whatever it's been. What is it? 73?

Speaker 31466.2s - 1467.96s

No, not the NBA. Oh, well, no, but

Speaker 21467.96s - 1469.3s

I'm talking about the final

Speaker 31469.3s - 1472s

of the Eastern Conference final. Yeah,

Speaker 21472.14s - 1473.7s

they haven't been to the East Conference finals since

Speaker 31473.7s - 1477.32s

I was playing for the Jets or something like that. Yeah, 90. Yeah. 94.

Speaker 21477.46s - 1478.94s

Come on now. In New York?

Speaker 31479.9s - 1490.9s

Look, I do think the refs get caught up and how hard the Knicks play in the fourth quarter because Josh Hart is a hard playing, you know what, man. You just, refs get influenced by that.

Speaker 51491.26s - 1496.5s

Jaylor Brunson is just not going to be denied. And as they should. Yeah.

Speaker 31496.62s - 1500.26s

Because if you're the more aggressive team, you should get the whistle.

Speaker 51500.26s - 1501.1s

That is true.

Speaker 31501.48s - 1521.8s

All right. Okay, we got to ask this question. Is it time for a post-mortem on the Nuggets? Are the Nuggets done? Yeah, Mike Malone. When it comes to travel, we all know that feeling of wanting to escape to our happy place,

Speaker 21521.8s - 1611.26s

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Speaker 31615.52s - 1617.02s

Nuggets Coach Michael Malone

Speaker 01617.02s - 1619.42s

all but begged his team, implored,

Speaker 31619.56s - 1621.16s

beseeched his team to quit

Speaker 01621.16s - 1623.32s

messing around in first quarters

Speaker 31623.32s - 1658.08s

and to start early, especially against these T-W wolves. And you looked up and Denver faced its largest home first half deficit, 61 to 35, in its playoff history. Once again, the defending champs at home looked overmatched on both ends of the floor. Minnesota 106 to 80?And now Minnesota is a four and a half point favorite in Friday nights game three at Minnesota. So, Kishon, you tried to warn us about this. Is this series now completely utterly over? It's a rap.

Speaker 21658.36s - 1670.22s

It's a rap. Because now think about it, they got to go. You just said four and a half point favors at home. So they got to go home. Denver has to go and try to win two to even the score.

Speaker 11670.64s - 1676.36s

They're not going to get, they're not going to take two from the way that these guys are playing, despite not even having Rudy Gober in the lineup.

Speaker 41676.6s - 1677.66s

He wasn't hurt.

Speaker 11678s - 1682.06s

He was going to take care of business with his wife and his family and his newborn baby and congratulations.

Speaker 21683.12s - 1722.54s

To that, you're going to have some, some nicer, some times that you're going to be up late at night, buddy. I'm just telling you as a father. So when you look at the ant man, everything he does is just kind of infectious to the rest of the team. He even gave you a Michael Jordan kind of like, he knocked down, I think it was the three he knocked down.He just gave you the shoulders like they can't do anything with me. The attitude along trickles down to the rest of the team. Everybody, think about it. Their rim protector did not play, and they figured out defensively how to negate the Joker from having a Joker-ish game like he had against the Lakers.

Speaker 41723.04s - 1724.42s

I mean, how did that happen?

Speaker 21724.9s - 1730.08s

Where did it happen? And then you say, well, Jamal Murray, well, Jamal Murray, for the last couple games, he didn't witness protection.

Speaker 41730.68s - 1731.76s

You've got to find him.

Speaker 21731.84s - 1765.22s

I don't want to hear anything about my calf, heard, and you're out on the floor. You're playing. He is. And you didn't show up and do anything. So I think it's over with,yeah, I think it's over. I think it's done. And Paul Pierce the other day, Rick tried to tell me as a Hall of Fame NBA guy that the experience and all of that lend itself toward the nuggets with this one because they've been there and done it. Okay, they won one championship last year.It wasn't like they won two of the last three or four to last four. They won't one. They are the Lakers' daddies.

Speaker 31765.58s - 1795.3s

Okay, that's fine. We ain't talking about the Lakers, though, Skip. We're talking about this young Minnesota bull of a team. That, you know, I don't want to call them young. They're stars young. Because Rudy Gaubert is not young.Carl Anthony Towns is not young. Connolly certainly isn't young. And when you average his age into the mix of all him, they're older. But their star is a young rising star right before our eyes that there's comparisons to one of the greatest they ever do it, if not the greatest they ever do it. Just comparisons. What do you mean if not?

Speaker 21795.86s - 1801.3s

Well, what are you talking about? I say if not, skip. Just give it up. Just give in to it and go. It's not me.

Speaker 31801.46s - 1805.22s

I'm just everybody has their own opinion about who the top dog is.

Speaker 21805.38s - 1806.2s

That's all I'm saying.

Speaker 31806.32s - 1808.32s

But Rick, I think it's over.

Speaker 21808.74s - 1819.4s

I understand dinner champs and they can always come back. But to think about it, do you really honestly think Minnesota is going to surrender to at home when they can taste it? This is this close?

Speaker 51819.76s - 1829.58s

I don't know that they're going to surrender it, but I can't help but feel that I have not seen this entire playoff run anything that resembles the Denver Nuggets of a year ago.

Speaker 41830.18s - 1833.98s

And granted, Bruce Brown is not there.

Speaker 51834.14s - 1835.4s

Jeff Green is not there.

Speaker 41836.02s - 1842.44s

I'm not going to attribute the difference that I see in them because their bench is a little bit shorter.

Speaker 51843.44s - 1867.38s

Nicola Yokic is shooting 42% in this series through two games. Your man, Jamal Murray, is shooting 28%. My man. I thought that the way they played against the Lakers through the first three games was boredom. We own these guys.We don't have to play hard. We need 16 wins to accomplish what we did last year.

Speaker 01867.68s - 1871.86s

Let's conserve our energy as much as we can and do the minimum.

Speaker 41872.06s - 1873.58s

And then they lost game four.

Speaker 01873.92s - 1879.12s

And I thought, okay, here's the wake-up call. They're going to go home and they're going to dominate.

Speaker 51879.8s - 1941.38s

And when they didn't, it was the first time that my confidence in the Denver Nuggets was shaken because I thought, maybe this isn't boredom. Maybe this is fatigue. Maybe this is carrying what champions, defending champions have to carry in terms of getting everybody's best shot, going up against some young guns like the Oklahoma City Thunder and the Minnesota Timberwolves and chasing that number one seed in the West. Maybe it's just taken its toll on them. And so I'm not going to say that the series is over until I see game three.Because on the flip side of this is a Minnesota Timberwolves team that for the first time this year has gotten out of the first round. And now it's a little bit different in taking a lead against the Denver Nuggets, the defending champions, and putting that defending champion on death's doorstep.

Speaker 41942.1s - 1945.42s

And so this game three, the pressure going home up

Speaker 51945.42s - 1958.38s

2 O now is going to flip. I think Denver's not going to feel any pressure. They're just like, we've got to go for it now. And we'll see if the Denver Nuggets still have a button to push. Because to this point, I haven't seen it.Okay.

Speaker 31959.38s - 1965.98s

I am with Rick on this. I am not giving completely up on these Denver Nuggets, and I love it that you said

Speaker 41965.98s - 1968.26s

it's a wrap. We got it on tape.

Speaker 31968.42s - 1991.62s

It's a rap. Done. This team has too much basketball character to lay down and die in game three. I think you will get their best shot, and ifthey win game three, obviously, you're looking up this Everest of a mountain because you've got to win four out of five to win this series, and it feels virtually, if not completely impossible

Speaker 41991.62s - 1995.84s

as we speak. As I tweeted last night, it's going to take a miracle.

Speaker 01996.14s - 2006.06s

And then right when I tweeted, Anthony Edwards got his arm tangled up with Joker and he went to the bench and he's rubbing his shoulder on thinking, is that a miracle? Because he can almost take something like that. He rubbed his shoulder for two seconds and right

Speaker 12006.06s - 2013.76s

back on the point. He did, which is what 22 years of age can do for you, right? Okay. I will say

Speaker 22013.76s - 2021.3s

this. It felt like they hit bottom last night in ways I never thought possible when with four minutes

Speaker 12021.3s - 2026s

and 11 seconds left in the second quarter, they can't get out of their own way.

Speaker 02026.24s - 2030.3s

And all of a sudden, I see a pad, a heating pad, fly into the fray.

Speaker 32030.3s - 2031.72s

Is that championship basketball?

Speaker 22031.96s - 2036.36s

I'm just saying this is a man who's out of his mind.

Speaker 32036.54s - 2039.08s

He is the three for 18 guys.

Speaker 22039.4s - 2040s

He's over on the bat.

Speaker 42040.08s - 2043.82s

He throws a heating pad, Jamal Murray did, into the fray.

Speaker 02043.92s - 2061.28s

He just throws it in like, is he throwing in the towel? Is that the equivalent of? But that's how out of it he was with frustration, where you just finally say, I can't watch this anymore. I'm going to throw this in there. Would you have been capable of doing something like that in the fourth quarter?

Speaker 22061.28s - 2062.48s

No, I would have never done that.

Speaker 32062.48s - 2072.08s

Now, if you tell me what I have thrown a towel or squirted water on a referee walking by or something like that,

Speaker 22072.2s - 2076s

yeah, I probably would have done that. I probably, if I'm that frustrated,

Speaker 42076s - 2086.56s

to the point where I'm just, yeah, I can see myself that, but I wouldn't never get that frustrated, though. I just, I wouldn't, no. Are you saying you didn't take it that seriously? No, I did, but I just wouldn't get that frustrated, though. I just, I wouldn't. Are you saying you didn't take it that seriously?

Speaker 32086.72s - 2089.18s

No, I did, but I just wouldn't get that frustrated to the point.

Speaker 22089.46s - 2097.06s

And I don't really know if he actually was throwing it or he was throwing it down and it slid out.

Speaker 52097.06s - 2102.24s

I don't, I don't really. I think he was having such a bad shooting night that even the-

Speaker 22102.24s - 2103.12s

It bounced wrong.

Speaker 52103.5s - 2105.92s

Yeah, I don't think, you know what I'm saying? No, Skip. I don't know

Speaker 32105.92s - 2108s

that he intentionally threw it on the

Speaker 52108s - 2110.22s

floor or he was throwing it down

Speaker 32110.22s - 2115.96s

to the point where the people that was in front of him, he didn't want to hit when he was throwing it down, so he threw it slightly

Speaker 12115.96s - 2120.24s

in front of him and it slid across the floor. That's just, I'm just

Speaker 22120.24s - 2124.44s

saying, I don't know. You must have been something in the principal's office. See, what I meant to do

Speaker 52124.44s - 2146.26s

was, and what happened was. So you really happened was. So you really think that he, Rick, you think based on the evidence that we see in the video, that he deliberately threw it. No, no, no. No, I'm with you. I just, I just wouldn't, I wouldn't try to explain it. I think everything went wrong.And that was only part and parcel of an entire team that lost its focus.

Speaker 22146.62s - 2148.24s

That's what was most...

Speaker 12148.24s - 2150.38s

But if you're a championship team...

Speaker 22150.38s - 2165.72s

That doesn't happen. You don't do that. Agreed. And I think it reflects the level of frustration that they had, that they could not get anything done. And I think the biggest reason is because they're all trying to do it individually.

Speaker 52166.44s - 2170.84s

And the one thing you would think from a championship team is we need to come together.

Speaker 32171.38s - 2178.34s

Jamal Murray, they have Jaden McDaniels, Anthony Edwards, like, you're not going to win those one-on-one

Speaker 52178.34s - 2195.14s

battles. Nicola Yokic, the reason I put him at the top of my MVP ballot this year for the first time was because I saw from the beginning of the year that when you put a smaller defender on him, he wasn't going to just pass or wait for the double team. He was going to put that guy into the paint

Speaker 12195.14s - 2206.04s

and was going to score on him so that if you were going to double team him, you better come in a hurry if there's an undersized guy. He's not doing that. He's playing

Speaker 52206.04s - 2229.72s

so soft and casual and Jamal's trying to do too much. And now Aaron Gordon and Cantavia's Caldwell Popper their cuts are slow and they just don'tlook like the Denver nuggets that took so many teams apart last year. And I can't quite explain it. I'm going to give the Minnesota Timberwell's credit. They split this year, though, Rick.

Speaker 02229.88s - 2232.84s

Understood. They've presented the greatest challenge.

Speaker 52233.78s - 2268.34s

But if, look, if the nuggets are aggressive, if Nicola Yokic is aggressive, and Jamal Murray doesn't try to do too much. If they involve everybody and they're getting beat like this, I'm good. I just haven't seen the Denver Nuggets come anywhere close to playing the type of basketball that they can play. Maybe it won't be good enough. But I can't, I mean, it was the same against the Lakers. The Lakers stayed close because the Denver Nuggets simply were sleepwalking through the

Speaker 42268.34s - 2275.82s

better part. Unforced errors. Guys not playing hard. Okay, that was the Lakers. To your point,

Speaker 52275.92s - 2280.7s

like you've owned them. I get that. Oh, man, stop. This is a different. Well, you know that is true.

Speaker 42280.7s - 2287.04s

You know that's, I mean, you can't argue that. You can't go to the principal's office and say, well, no, actually, we were.

Speaker 22287.04s - 2292.44s

But could it be such that the Lakers made them play a certain way for three, three and a half quarters?

Speaker 52292.58s - 2302.2s

It's the same way Minnesota is making them play a certain way because of Minnesota's length, their athleticism, the things that they're capable of doing, they're running big guys in and out of the lineup with length.

Speaker 22302.46s - 2310.62s

Could it be such that you make a team play different because of the challenges that you present for them?

Speaker 42311.1s - 2322.68s

This isn't last year, like you said, Rick, they, I guess ran through the Western Conference won the championship, whatever you want to call it. That was probably their best shot last year. That was probably their best shot.

Speaker 52323.02s - 2326.12s

Do you think that the Denver Nuggets have

Speaker 22326.12s - 2327.8s

been aggressive and played

Speaker 52327.8s - 2331.44s

on-point basketball the way we saw them play last year to this point?

Speaker 22332.18s - 2349.96s

I do, and here's the reason I say that in the playoffs. Here's the reason I say that because the same Western Conference challenge that the Lakers presented for them, they lost it about 20 minutes in those four gamesthat 20 minutes is why they lost. The last five minutes of each one of those games, the Nuggets

Speaker 52349.96s - 2355.06s

had their number. Yeah, but don't you think that the first 40, or whatever,

Speaker 22355.78s - 2375.54s

the first three quarters, three and a half quarters, weren't because the Lakers, I mean, the Nuggets knew that they could get to those final minutes and say, we don't have to win the game in the first second or third No, I don't think so. We don't have to win the game in the first, second or third quarter. I don't think so.Here's the difference. Last night in particular, the game was one in the first half. Half time, what was it, 30 points in a half? How about the first two minutes?

Speaker 32375.56s - 2396.28s

Or the first two minutes, whatever. Seriously. They just took the game over. The difference in the Lakers in Minnesota is Minnesota was up by 30. They never surrendered that lead. They got down the 19 maybe, I think.And that was it. They went right back up. The Lakers would have a 30, a 20 plus lead, and they'd just blow it. But the Nuggets would look at them like, it's cute.

Speaker 22396.46s - 2397.1s

You know, that's cute.

Speaker 52397.3s - 2397.86s

That's nice.

Speaker 22398s - 2398.84s

Well, watch this.

Speaker 52399.08s - 2401.22s

Because they didn't finish the deal.

Speaker 22401.88s - 2403.48s

Minnesota wasn't going to allow it to happen.

Speaker 52403.48s - 2408.32s

But the Nuggets could do that against the Lakers at the end of the first half.

Speaker 22408.82s - 2424.2s

Like pull it back within three or five. Let's just keep it close until we need to close this out. And look, maybe they've created some bad habits. Maybe you just can't get out of that slow start mentality because you haven't had to,

Speaker 32424.6s - 2426.96s

but they're going to have to have, they're going to have to find it now.

Speaker 52427.04s - 2433.1s

Jamal Murray is still the best closer in the game. He just hasn't had anything to close in games

Speaker 32433.1s - 2439.22s

one and two, even though one was still something of a game until Anthony Edwards said, I got

Speaker 52439.22s - 2446.84s

this. This time it's mine. And yet, if you give him a shot in game three to close it, I will bet you he will

Speaker 32446.84s - 2462.38s

close it. I'll bet he'll rise above this. He's just up against a three-headed monster because he's got Anthony on him this time down. And then the next time down, it's Jaden McDaniels, who's six, nine, and long. And then the next time down, it's Alexander Walker, who's also, I don't know how,

Speaker 22462.48s - 2479.22s

is he six, seven? He's got a bit? He's got a nice wing span for sure. But he's big, long. Think about what you just said, though, Skip. And I'm not going back to the Lakers, but think about what you just said. You just named three guys that are all bigger than the people outside Anthony Davis that at the end of the games, we force. Think about it.

Speaker 32479.24s - 2481.48s

Well, it's Austin Reeves trying to chase him.

Speaker 22481.98s - 2484.62s

Smaller, not as athletic as none of these guys.

Speaker 32484.82s - 2486.52s

I mean, Austin Reeves is 6-7.

Speaker 22486.6s - 2495.3s

He's just not long, and he's not athletic and explosive. Exactly. So they're faced with a different challenge from a defensive standpoint. Agreed.

Speaker 52495.36s - 2500.5s

But don't you think that Jamal Murray knew at the end of the game, I'm going to be guarded by Austin Reeves?

Speaker 22500.62s - 2505.9s

And so I can go get this. My issue with Jamal, and you're right,

Speaker 52506s - 2575.38s

like, as a closer, he can give it to you when you need it. I feel like he's hunting that in the first and second quarter, which is not getting everybody else involved. And I don't need you to prove anything to me in the first or second quarter. We need, I need Yokic, if he's going to be guarded by six-nine Nas Reid, forcing that second defender and forcing it early so that Michael Porter Jr. It has wider open shots. I mean, even the shots that Denver was getting were difficult. And I've been told this by scouts in the league, minnesota is most formidable is one-on-onedefense that they have all these great one-on-one defenders but if you make anthony edwards chase and rotate if you make carl anthony towns have to make decisions like now you can open mike connolly you can get switches now you can try to find some holes in that number one defense. And the Denver Nuggets are simply not doing that. They're all individually trying to beat them. And as we've said, the matchups don't work for them in that case. They're not

Speaker 32575.38s - 2593.62s

going to win this series if that doesn't change. But the Nuggets did beat them twice in the regular season. So it's not like it's impossible to do. And Kishan, the other point is, Rick and I have been doing this for a long, long time covering these playoffs series. They do tend to flip on their head when you least expect it.

Speaker 12593.76s - 2597.08s

Oh, that's true. You'll say it'll happen. Wait a minute. They're in the driver's seen.

Speaker 22597.24s - 2599.26s

Oh, wait a minute. No, they're not.

Speaker 32600s - 2602.8s

Are you almost certainly right about this?

Speaker 22602.8s - 2606.24s

It's just something about that guy that we're going to talk about.

Speaker 32606.46s - 2606.72s

Yeah.

Speaker 22607.1s - 2608.76s

It's something about his eyes, man.

Speaker 32608.76s - 2613.36s

That tells me he's not going to allow that to happen.

Speaker 22613.42s - 2614.24s

I've seen this before.

Speaker 32614.46s - 2617.26s

I've seen guys like that. I'm not getting ready to let these guys come back.

Speaker 22617.26s - 2625.96s

Carl Anthony said after the game last night, as long as he's talking S.H., we good. You know, like they like to hear that. Absolutely. They haven't had that before. Absolutely. That., we good. You know, like they like to hear that. Absolutely. They haven't had that before.

Speaker 32626.12s - 2632.04s

Absolutely. That is called leadership. I don't give a damn how old he is. That's called leadership.

Speaker 42632.28s - 2634.22s

Yeah. You know, I'm not about,

Speaker 22634.3s - 2644.98s

as you would tell me about Michael, not about, not on my watch. That's Anthony Edwards. It's not on my watch. It's not going to happen. I'm going to take game one over in the end. Oh, they're coming back. I got this. Don't worry about it.

Speaker 32646.22s - 2659.56s

Cat, for years, I thought he had, if you will, a little game one over in the end. Oh, they're coming back. I got this. Don't even worry about it. Cat, for years, I thought he had, if you will, a little too much kid in him, you know, just a little too much kid. You know, and he needed some of this. And he is feeding off this kid. All it takes one. It takes one. He's gotsome of that Kishon in him, right?

Speaker 22659.68s - 2665.34s

A little bit. A little bit. I'd have been over a long time ago if it was me. Oh, wow. I'd have been on the Lakers. I'd have been on the Lakers. We'd have been on the Lakers. Billy. Yeah. I'd have been over a long time ago if it was me. Oh, wow.

Speaker 42665.52s - 2666.24s

I'd have been on the Lakers.

Speaker 32666.24s - 2667.12s

I'd have been on the Lakers.

Speaker 42667.24s - 2667.62s

We'd have won.

Speaker 32668.34s - 2668.66s

Billy.

Speaker 22668.92s - 2671.78s

Yeah. If you had been a Laker, you would have won, really.

Speaker 32672.16s - 2673.72s

Even if I was sitting on the bench and never played.

Speaker 22674.22s - 2676.58s

Because I'd have been getting into somebody's ass. Okay.

Speaker 32677.48s - 2677.98s

For sure.

Speaker 22678.58s - 2682.58s

And it could be basketball, not football. It doesn't matter what sport it is.

Speaker 52682.72s - 2689.4s

I'm not going to sit back and watch what took place. You would have made Austin Reeves a lockdown defender. Why not?

Speaker 22690.06s - 2690.58s

Just tell him.

Speaker 52690.6s - 2692.52s

I just want to make sure I got it straight.

Speaker 22692.68s - 2693.48s

Get up in it.

Speaker 32693.84s - 2694.72s

Don't be afraid.

Speaker 52695.44s - 2696.22s

Get up on him.

Speaker 22696.5s - 2700.42s

Listen, that second shot that Jamal made, Austin Reeves was all over it.

Speaker 32700.54s - 2700.74s

He was.

Speaker 22700.74s - 2703.7s

He let him get in front of him around. A bit. Well, he got picked.

Speaker 32703.9s - 2710s

Yeah, he got picked a little bit. But then Anthony Davis got put in the bind because he couldn't close down because Joker was behind him.

Speaker 22710s - 2711s

So he kind of had to play on board.

Speaker 32711s - 2712s

Back in the principal's office.

Speaker 22712s - 2713s

Yeah.

Speaker 32713s - 2714s

What happened was?

Speaker 52714s - 2715s

Explain, huh?

Speaker 32715s - 2720s

I'm going to let Kishan live in his delusion over there for a little bit through this commercial break.

Speaker 52720s - 2725.46s

Up next, is Tuck Loo still even a remote possibility for the Lakers?

Speaker 32725.92s - 2727.62s

Rick's got the inside on that.

Speaker 22728s - 2729.96s

How did the Lakers sneak back into the conversation?

Speaker 32730.9s - 2735.98s

Hey, folks, it's your man, Kishan Johnson here to talk about Angie.

Speaker 22736.38s - 2740.52s

Formerly known as Angie's list, your go-to-home services,

Speaker 32740.88s - 2743.46s

marketplace for getting all your jobs done well.

Speaker 22743.76s - 2824.7s

Now you might be wondering what exactly is Angie? Well, let me tell you, it's the nation's largest home services marketplace, connecting over 150 million homeowners with skilled professionals to tackle any project big or small. As a homeowner myself, I always have things I want to work on for my house, whether it's general home renovations or fun projects like putting in a pool with a small. As a homeowner myself, I always have things I want to work on for my house, whether it's general home renovations or fun projects like putting in a pool. With over 200,000 pros in their network, Angie makes it a breeze to research, compare and hire pros, ensuringevery job is done well. Whether you're fixing a leaky faucet or planning a full kitchen renovation, Angie's got your back. And get this, folks, Angie's pros aren't just any old contractors. They're your neighbors, often running small businesses right in your community. Plus, they've been rated and reviewed by others in your area. So you know, you're getting quality service. So why stress over home projects when you can turn to Angie?From finding the best price to scheduling a pro at your convenience, Angie's got you covered every step of the way. So get started today at Angie.com. That's Angie.com or download the app today to get started on getting all your jobs done. That's Angie, your trusted ally in home services. That's Angie, your trusted ally in home services.

Speaker 32830.14s - 2846.4s

Shams reports that candidates to replace Darvinham as Lakers coach include Mike Boodenholzer, Kenny Atkinson, Charles Lee, J.J. Reddick, and Tailu. There he is again. So, Rick, what do you make a Tailu continuing to be listed as a reported candidate for this job?

Speaker 52846.6s - 2850.88s

That what is driving this list is it's LeBron James's wish list.

Speaker 32851.22s - 2852.68s

Oh, interesting.

Speaker 52853.06s - 2861.78s

And that and any other candidate that we can somehow connect to what the Lakers might be after,

Speaker 32861.96s - 2864.48s

as opposed to that there's real direction here.

Speaker 52864.52s - 2917.28s

And I think it's a reflection of where the Lakers are, which is really at cross purposes. Like, what do we want? Mike Boodenholzer and Charles Lee are two completely different level coaches in terms of experience and everything else. Are we getting a young coach that we're hoping to catch lightning in a bottle with, or are we looking for the veteran coach with a championship pedigree that can take this one last shot at it? And then we've got JJ Reddick, who's never coached before. So to me,it reflects the fact that this isn't a job that everybody's pining for. It's a job that the Lakers are trying to figure out who can we get. And this is not the first time that it's happened in recent memory. That's where we ended up. Terry Stotz was a candidate for the Lakers job.

Speaker 02917.28s - 2923.12s

And it ended up with Darwin Ham largely because he was the guy that they could sell

Speaker 52923.12s - 2932.48s

and the guy who wanted the job. And I look at the circumstances that the Lakers are in right now, Kisham. I'm listening to you.

Speaker 22932.58s - 2941.72s

I know. This is important for you to hear to understand where the Lakers are right now. This is not an attractive job. It's never an attractive job, believe it or not.

Speaker 52941.72s - 2976.62s

Well, it's a particularly unattractive job right now because you have LeBron James and Anthony Davis and the expectations of playing for championships. And yet, that's not a reality with this roster, nor do you have the resources to make it into a championship roster. So if I'm coming in with high expectations and low resources, what head coach, what coach, whether young or old, wants to step into that? Well, you start with LeBron James,

Speaker 22976.96s - 2985.42s

right? Do you want to have a relationship in coach LeBron James? That's number one, because you've got to have it.

Speaker 42985.78s - 2988.28s

You've got to have a relationship to be able to coach him.

Speaker 22988.58s - 2990.74s

You can't just bring in anybody.

Speaker 02991.12s - 2991.42s

Anybody.

Speaker 22992.38s - 2998.46s

Can't bring in Boonehoser just because he's a name that's out there. Right, and he has a ring. And he has a ring.

Speaker 52998.66s - 3008.74s

That's not going to work. Agree. We've tried that many times in the past with other stars that we've had with the Lakers. Every time the Laker job comes open we've had with the Lakers. Every time a Laker job comes open, it's never the first candidate.

Speaker 23011.08s - 3012.42s

If you covered back, you've been covering this stuff for a while. Very true. It's never the first candidate.

Speaker 13012.86s - 3014.88s

This is why I said this, this is always happening.

Speaker 43014.98s - 3017.42s

We go through a list. Yep.

Speaker 23017.58s - 3030.22s

And we may miss on guys that we actually should have hired in the past like a TIE loop. We wouldn't be having this conversation. Had we, and I say we as a Laker fan and front office guy of the Lakers,

Speaker 43030.52s - 3064.7s

had we made the decision not to tell him, you can't hire who you want. You've got to take our assistance that we want you to hire. And low-balled him. And all that's part of it. Can't do that with a guy with this resume who knows what he's going to do. Because, bombers, you think him and Jerry West are going to allow Ty Lou to stay in Staple Center, not a chance.So that's, we might as well even stop having that conversation. Agreed. He's going to write the check whenever they're trying to figure out economically if they want to bring back the Hardens in Georgia. They're trying to figure all that out. The money's not an issue.

Speaker 23065.04s - 3105.28s

Now you start to say, candidates, JJ Reddy, do you want a guy who's never done it before? We all like JJ. We call the game's great. It was a great knockdown shooter, all those sort of things. But do you really want a guy who's never done it,despite being able to get some top assistants to come along with him and teach him the ropes. In LeBron James' last couple years, do you want to waste that messing around and be back into a situation that you've been in the last couple years, which is playing tournaments and things that nature? Probably not. So now you start to look at the checklist, and I'll keep bringing up Fisdale.

Speaker 43105.74s - 3110.58s

I agree with that. I'll keep bringing that up because there's a relationship that's there.

Speaker 23111.3s - 3115.4s

Now, whether or not LeBron is telling them, hey, take a look at Fizz, I don't know. But I'm just saying there's a relationship.

Speaker 33115.4s - 3116.94s

Well, he's not making the wish list.

Speaker 43117.32s - 3119.28s

Well, at least publicly.

Speaker 33120.22s - 3126.22s

But here's a guy when you look at Fizz's tenure in Memphis.

Speaker 23126.82s - 3162.44s

They went to the playoffs to one year. They won 40-some-odd games or whatever it was. Then all of a sudden next year they went seven. He's gone at the start of the season. Then he takes the Knicks job. Did you see the roster that he had with the Knicks?He's 22 games in. He's fired. So you say to yourself, you give a guy like that real player skip, give him Anthony Davis and give him LeBron James and see what he can do, because you're giving other people those opportunities. Now all of a sudden you've got the assistant coach out of Boston.Charles Lee. Charles Lee. All of a sudden, he's, oh my God, we should hire him.

Speaker 33163.04s - 3165.48s

Well, he's your Darwin Ham. He'd be the next.

Speaker 23165.76s - 3177.94s

Same thing. I would rather go get a guy who's done it and had mild success with bad team or bad rosters and was able to get something out of him and then turn to him and take a look at it.

Speaker 33178s - 3206.82s

That's just me, though. All right. Allow me to attempt to read Tailu's mind. I don't know him. I have not talked to him about this. I'm just going to tell you what I believe from a distance.I believe if you put Ty Lou on a lie detector right now, and we're going to go deeper into the Clippers in just a few minutes here, I believe he would tell you I would have a slightly better chance of winning a championship with the Lakers next year than the Clippers. We don't know how the Clippers are going to sort themselves out with Paul George and James Harden.

Speaker 43207.78s - 3216.1s

But because of Tye's relationship with LeBron, I believe he believes he could get the very best out of LeBron

Speaker 33216.1s - 3251.12s

and maybe help save him from himself minutes-wise from early in the season to later, which is how Darwin and LeBron clashed early last year. Let's try to restrict for your own good. And LeBron says, no, you Darwin clashed early last year. Let's try to restrict for your own good. And LeBron says, no, you can't make me do that. I'm going to play as many.And he winds up playing the fifth most average per night minutes in the league. I just think that Ty Lou won with LeBron. I do think they have a bond. I think he has a deeper respect for LeBron than a lotof people do because he thinks he could get down under a deeper respect for LeBron than a lot of people do because he thinks he could get down under the surface and that LeBron will listen in a good way to Ty.

Speaker 43251.8s - 3258.76s

So my point is the only reason I could see this being out there on this list on Shams' list

Speaker 33258.76s - 3272.74s

is because somehow Ty is letting it known that he would have some intrigue with the Laker job. But he's under contract. He would have to go to Steve Ballmer and say, you've got to let me go. I would rather go coach them.

Speaker 03272.84s - 3294.14s

Like if he goes and says, my heart's just not in this anymore, I don't think we can go any farther than we went because I don't trust Kauai's health. And I don't trust James in big late games and blah, blah, all those things that I have issues with. I think Ty would also have issues with. Does he want to fight with Russ coming off the bench a whole other year?It's hard, man. It's a grind.

Speaker 23294.34s - 3317.36s

What's harder, though, Skip, fighting with Russ or worrying about whether Kauai's going to get hurt, or if James Hardin's going to have a bad night, what's worse? Or dealing with Linda Rambez, Kurt Rambez, Rob Polinka, and Jeannie Bus. What you think for Tylo, who's been in that building and have dealt with that organization?

Speaker 33317.58s - 3320.52s

Is AD going to, is he going to show up tonight or is he going to get hurt tonight?

Speaker 23320.56s - 3321.84s

Well, he played 70 plus games.

Speaker 03321.84s - 3325.2s

I know, but then we got to the final game and he

Speaker 23325.2s - 3331.98s

banged shoulders with Michael Porter Jr. And he's like, I think I just died. But think about that.

Speaker 03332.28s - 3339s

Here's a organization that you played for, one championship, did everything for when it was time

Speaker 23339s - 3343.74s

for you to get the head coaching job. They lowballed you economically. And then they wanted to give

Speaker 43343.74s - 3345.32s

you me as your assistant.

Speaker 03345.72s - 3346.56s

That's what they wanted.

Speaker 23346.62s - 3372.24s

They wanted us to be as assistant coaches. That's true. So do you honestly think that as much love as he got for LeBron and maybe AD and some other guys on the team that he would want to deal with that versus I don't have to deal with that with Balmer and Jerry Westing company over there? No, I don't. And I'm going to get my money. And I'm going to be a $17, $18 million coach.Why would I want to deal with that?

Speaker 33372.34s - 3375.04s

Just because you think you might have a slightly better chance to win?

Speaker 53376.02s - 3422.24s

Yeah, this is what I know about Ty Lou. And it's when he came out and said, I'm not looking to go any place else. when he came out and said, I'm not looking to go any place else. Tye is not the type. There are coaches in the league that would have been doing that to createan image of, I'm not interested in behind the scenes. To your point, Larry Brown, like. I'm trying to make it happen, right? I'm just trying to put a good face on this.But, yeah, I'd like to backdoor my way into the other team in the city. I don't get that with Tailu. If he's saying, I don't want to go anywhere, I buy that. And part of it is that the clippers, unlike the Lakers, demonstrated a faith in him. Yes.

Speaker 03422.52s - 3439.44s

We want you. And don't underestimate when you are a role player in the NBA, which is people aren't putting faith in you. Like, you're a ride-along. You're a come-along. And now somebody says, hey, you know what?As a coach, you're our guy.

Speaker 53440.42s - 3454.04s

That has power. And the Lakers basically did the exact opposite. Yes. They said, yeah, you know what, LeBron wants you, but we're not really buying you. If we can get you on the cheap, okay, we'll go along with it.

Speaker 23454.04s - 3458.5s

As an athlete, as an athlete, I don't think Ty gets over that. And that's what I'm trying to tell Skip.

Speaker 53458.6s - 3461.18s

As an athlete, though Skip, and you've covered us a long time.

Speaker 23462.08s - 3478.08s

There's certain things, like Rick is saying, it's trust, it's belief. Yeah. And if I ever sniff or smell that you don't trust and believe that I can get something done, now you're coming back to the dance the second time around.Think about it. The girl in high school told you no.

Speaker 43478.4s - 3482.96s

And then when you became Skip Bayless, eventually she tried to come back.

Speaker 23483.04s - 3484.04s

You said, I know, I'm good.

Speaker 43484.18s - 3490.62s

It's disrespect. I'm good. I'm disrespect. I'm good. I'm good. I don't want to go out with you right now. This is a situation that ties face.

Speaker 33490.72s - 3496.36s

All right. JJ Reddick, I'm just speaking selfishly because of what we do.

Speaker 23496.36s - 3496.92s

You wanted to happen.

Speaker 53496.92s - 3507.8s

I wanted to happen because we would be all over it every day. A thousand percent with you. Could JJ Reddick turn into Pat Riley? The next Pat Riley is coming up from broadcasting into Laker Nation. I don't mean to cut you. Could J.J. Reddick turn into Pat Riley. The next Pat Riley is coming up from broadcasting into Laker Nation.

Speaker 23507.8s - 3509.98s

I don't mean to cut you off, Skip, but

Speaker 53509.98s - 3512.14s

Pat was on the bench. I know, he was.

Speaker 33512.14s - 3514.1s

Well, not only that, but he had a team

Speaker 23514.1s - 3515.86s

that was ready to go. Mercy,

Speaker 33516s - 3517.12s

did he have a team? Yeah, he was

Speaker 23517.12s - 3520.2s

at Diocese is all. He had

Speaker 53520.2s - 3521.1s

some coaching

Speaker 23521.1s - 3524.12s

in his blood because he had actually

Speaker 33524.12s - 3525.9s

been on the bench as an assistant.

Speaker 23526.16s - 3532.96s

But do not underestimate how LeBron has meshed minds with JJ during their X's and O's podcast.

Speaker 33533.06s - 3533.64s

That's one guy.

Speaker 23533.68s - 3535.36s

They are talking deep basketball.

Speaker 33535.36s - 3535.98s

That's one guy.

Speaker 23536.1s - 3538.3s

And LeBron's got the highest IQ in basketball.

Speaker 33538.52s - 3543.32s

And you can't tell me that he's not listening to JJ thinking, you know what?

Speaker 43543.42s - 3545.06s

This guy really gets it. But, but coach, that's one guy. JJ thinking, you know what? This guy really gets it.

Speaker 23545.26s - 3547.5s

But, but coach, that's one guy.

Speaker 33548.12s - 3548.96s

One guy, how?

Speaker 23549.3s - 3550.88s

Because it's LeBron and that's it.

Speaker 33550.98s - 3555.7s

You got 11 other dudes that he's got to get on the podcast with and design.

Speaker 23555.82s - 3556.3s

No, seriously.

Speaker 33556.3s - 3557.52s

Well, there's only one.

Speaker 03557.54s - 3558.1s

Think about it.

Speaker 33558.28s - 3563.86s

No, no, but being a coach, you got to manage personalities across.

Speaker 03564.04s - 3564.3s

Yes.

Speaker 23564.34s - 3565.64s

What if Westbrook was on that team?

Speaker 03565.72s - 3566.18s

Lord.

Speaker 33566.34s - 3567.16s

You see what I'm saying?

Speaker 03567.26s - 3575.92s

Or Pat Bev or somebody that you don't know how to communicate. They're not respecting you. You got to be able to get everybody's respect. Okay.

Speaker 33576.16s - 3578.46s

But Jay, Jay, he looks the part.

Speaker 23578.58s - 3585.18s

He can speak the part. He can act the part. You ran down his list. Steve Nash could do the same thing.

Speaker 33585.3s - 3586.24s

Guess what happened in Brooklyn?

Speaker 23586.44s - 3589.86s

Yeah, I think J.J's got a little more commanding officer in him.

Speaker 33590.02s - 3592.96s

I'm more leadership to him. I could be wrong.

Speaker 53593.12s - 3593.62s

I'll give you that.

Speaker 23593.9s - 3594.24s

I don't know.

Speaker 53594.24s - 3597.28s

One do is a Hall of Fame for a reason.

Speaker 33597.62s - 3603.36s

What did we could, what was the big criticism with Darwin Ham, which was time management?

Speaker 53603.9s - 3631.16s

Yeah. Matchups. In-game decisions. He at least had the experience of being an assistant coach and watching Mike Boodenholzer do that all the way to a champion. He did. J.J. Reddick has never been in the fire. I think it was, Fran Frantzilla made fun of the way he drew a play on the whiteboard. He's like, you're going to have to get better at your play drawing skills.

Speaker 03631.36s - 3633.32s

Like, that's how far.

Speaker 53633.56s - 3646.92s

And this is the thing that I know with NBA players. It's probably the same in the NFL. The second you as a head coach demonstrate that you try to get them to do something that they know

Speaker 23646.92s - 3650.54s

doesn't work? The inability to get me to do what does not work.

Speaker 53650.96s - 3659.6s

You're 100% right. The inability to try and I know it's not going to work and you try to, and then I do it and it doesn't work? Yeah. You're done.

Speaker 33659.76s - 3669.38s

You're done. So, Kishon, sad but true, I'm not sure you can right here right now do any better than Darvinham off what's out there. I'm not sure about this.

Speaker 13670.5s - 3674.52s

As a coach, again, I'll go back to Fizz.

Speaker 23675.44s - 3676.34s

I go back to Fis.

Speaker 33676.7s - 3680.5s

Because again, remember, there's a respect that has to come with LeBron.

Speaker 23680.72s - 3681.28s

Absolutely.

Speaker 33681.4s - 3686.24s

As much as LeBron probably wanted to respect Darwin Ham,

Speaker 23686.44s - 3701.28s

he never really showed them anything to gain or earn that respect long term. That's why when you see in the playoffs, the bond in the middle of the floor, like, man, what the hell am I down here? What is going on? I got to deal with this again? That's when I knew.That's not.

Speaker 33701.4s - 3703.76s

No, I knew, but see, I didn't need to know that.

Speaker 23703.84s - 3706.68s

I knew when Anthonyis said what he said

Speaker 33706.68s - 3710.98s

toward the end of the season when they went on a little skid and he was like we don't know what

Speaker 23710.98s - 3715s

we're doing half the time that's when i knew it was over now i didn't need the playoffs to know

Speaker 33715s - 3720.14s

because you got to a second star player who's close to the star player who eats lunch and dinner

Speaker 43720.14s - 3724.14s

and breakfast with each other yeah and they having conversations and then anthony david just happened

Speaker 33724.14s - 3727.04s

to say it and also a guy who generally doesn't speak out like that.

Speaker 53727.18s - 3728.92s

No, that's another good point.

Speaker 33729.8s - 3730.98s

All right, back to the Knicks.

Speaker 53731.14s - 3736.26s

How far can they go playing their five starters pretty much the whole game?

Speaker 33743.9s - 3745.1s

So think about this.

Speaker 53745.2s - 3749.98s

The Pacers bench outscored the Knicks bench last night, 46 to 3.

Speaker 33750.2s - 3750.98s

That would be a typo.

Speaker 53751.98s - 3758.26s

Yet the Knicks prevailed by four playing their starters an average of 45 minutes.

Speaker 33758.26s - 3771.42s

That included Josh Hart, again, going all 48. So, Rick, can the Knicks sustain winning with their starters playing this many minutes? No, no, no, they can't.

Speaker 53771.42s - 3776.54s

Conventional wisdom would say, hell no. Yeah. I mean, look, I know they've done it all year.

Speaker 33776.54s - 3794.9s

I know these guys are soldiers, but they did it all year playing the slowest pace of any team in the league. And now they're going to play night after night, the team that plays the second fastest pace and has much more depth.

Speaker 53795s - 3801.72s

Look, Isaiah Hartinstein played the most minutes, or the fewest minutes, excuse me, of any New York Knicks starter.

Speaker 03802.42s - 3806.14s

Tyrese Halliburton played the most minutes

Speaker 53806.14s - 3875.76s

of any Pacer starter. They both played 36 minutes. That's the separation between these two teams. And I just look at, yes, as I said earlier, the New York Knicks out-executed the Indiana Pacers in the final minutes, but the Indiana Pacerslook to be the fresher team. And I just question whether Josh Hart with his double double and 12, 13 rebounds when he's playing against bigger, longer,a bigger, longer, deeper team, whether he's able to sustain that. And without any of that, without Jalen Brunson, 43 points, right? Josh Hart, 12, 13 rebounds. Do they win this game without that? And can you do that four times? That is hard for me to imagine. And the longer theseries goes, the more it tilts toward Indiana. And I say this as someone who came into the playoffs and into this series thinking, no, the Knicks are going to get this done. But if Tom Thibode doesn't change his approach, look, just give Miles McBride five more minutes.

Speaker 03876.68s - 3882.96s

Just give Alec Burke, like go into your depth and use a couple of the guys that are on your bench

Speaker 53882.96s - 3893.26s

and give your guys' breathers. And then I'm back on that Nick's bandwagon. But right now, I just do not think the formula in game one is sustainable for four wins.

Speaker 23893.66s - 3896.1s

Well, they did it in four wins against the Sixers.

Speaker 53896.36s - 3899.68s

Okay, but the Sixers still managed to play slower too.

Speaker 13899.68s - 3900.52s

No, no, I understand that,

Speaker 53900.56s - 3912.06s

but you say can they get the same type of production from Jalen Bronson and from Josh Hart? What they did against the Sixers. They got the same production. So it would tell me,

Speaker 23912.24s - 3935.24s

regardless of the minutes increase, these dudes are in shape. Yeah. It's not, because I'm playing against the team, that's the fastest. I now have to increase mine. I have to increase my workload. I know this. And you say, well, they can wear down in the second half or in the fourth quarter, they can wear it down. Yeah, they probably can, but they haven't displayed that yet.

Speaker 53935.62s - 3966.18s

That's the only problem that I have. I think they did. How? How so? He had 21. Jane of Brunsett had 21 in the fourth. Understood. But collectively, I thought that the Indiana Pacers looked like the – they didn't execute, but they looked to me like the fresher team down the stretch.And I just – you know, it comes to a possession, possession game, then yeah. You're still asking Jalen Brunson to go get all that by himself. That's the other part is that there are no easy

Speaker 23966.18s - 3978.76s

buckets for him. Like he has to work for every single thing that he gets. And that may be true, but he's knocking it down. They've yet to stop him. So it's one game. It's one game.

Speaker 53978.96s - 3986.92s

Well, I could go to the last series. And what did, and we talked about it earlier, how many times the turnovers that he had down the stretch.

Speaker 23987.46s - 3991.26s

What was about? You're trapped in the corner. Yeah.

Speaker 53991.42s - 3995.22s

That was a weirdo. To me, those are fatigue turnovers. Tired turnovers.

Speaker 23995.36s - 4017.94s

That's not somebody jump in a passing lane. That's not getting trapped. That is, I mean, he fumbled away those balls. See, I don't look at it. I don't necessarily look at it as fatigue. I mean, if you're trapping a guy and a guy is trapped, you got two guys that's nine feet tall over you,you got to figure out what to do with it. You happen to throw the ball. You did everything right. You got rid of the ball. It just bounced on.

Speaker 54017.94s - 4024.1s

That's the one, but the phantom kicked ball was simply just losing.

Speaker 34024.1s - 4057.28s

Bad idea. Just losing the ball. Same with the other one. He gets a losing. It was just losing the ball. Same with the other one. He gets a little too cool for school with the ball like he's nonchalant. Like I'm at the garden. I own the garden.And he just gets careless with the basketball. Not sure it's tired. By the way, quick stat for you to find a title team, an NBA title team that played at least three starters, 40 plus minutes through the playoffs. You've got to go back to your 1980 Los Angeles Lakers. They had four who played 40-plus minutes.Magic Kareem. It had been Magic's rookie year.

Speaker 24060.38s - 4065.68s

So it's Magic Kareem, Norm Nixon, and Jamal Wilkes. Okay, so all four of them were playing 40-plus minutes. So they're playing four starters a whole lot of time. Was that showtime?

Speaker 34067.7s - 4069s

Was that slow time? I don't remember. That was 1980. I don't know how...

Speaker 54069s - 4070.84s

Were they? They were getting up and down the coin?

Speaker 34070.84s - 4071.84s

They were playing up tempo.

Speaker 54071.88s - 4074.06s

Were they? I don't remember. That was so long ago.

Speaker 34074.06s - 4075.7s

This is magic for Kareem

Speaker 24075.7s - 4079.04s

in the... If magic was involved,

Speaker 54079.2s - 4080.38s

if James Worthy was involved,

Speaker 24080.48s - 4081.64s

they're playing up tempo.

Speaker 54082.22s - 4083.88s

Were they? Because I thought showtime

Speaker 24083.88s - 4086.06s

came once Pat got

Speaker 34086.06s - 4087.94s

there, but I could, whatever. I don't

Speaker 24087.94s - 4089.5s

want to go ahead. So,

Speaker 34089.94s - 4127.06s

you're probably right about this. Again, conventional wisdom would scream that you're right. But this is just the way I see things. So I grew up lovingthe sport of baseball. I love the St. Louis Cardinals. My favorite player was Bob Gibson. And in those days, every game he pitched, it's going to be, he's going to stay out there for nine innings, and it's going to be over in two hours and two minutes, because it's just give me the damn ball, and I'm going to throw it again. Do you remember Bob Gibson? Yeah, I remember. All right. The point was, nobody questioned itbecause he just did it every night. It's just how you did it. He's Bob Gibson.

Speaker 14127.36s - 4129.04s

Just let him go.

Speaker 04129.04s - 4149.64s

And now if the starter lasts two and two thirds, it's like an upset because they hit the bullpen. And then here we go. And it takes forever. And they're trying with the pitch clock to make it go faster, obviously, because they've lost a lot of young fans. But they didn't lose me in those days because I'm on the edge of my seat watching him pitch nine innings because I know he's going to stay out there for nine innings.

Speaker 24149.64s - 4151.4s

He's giving me seven and two-thirds of it.

Speaker 34151.4s - 4152s

Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 24152.48s - 4153.7s

I go to a game now.

Speaker 34153.8s - 4155.62s

It's like, you're taking him off the mouth already?

Speaker 24156.96s - 4157.48s

All right.

Speaker 34157.48s - 4160.84s

The point is, the mindset of these guys is

Speaker 24160.84s - 4163.34s

we can do this because we've been doing it

Speaker 34163.34s - 4164.82s

and we've been successful with it.

Speaker 24165.62s - 4171.58s

Will just attrition take over? Is it just, are the athletes just so much better now that they

Speaker 34171.58s - 4203.02s

will wear these four or five guys down and finally out? You could be right. But Thibodeau is driving them to think, this is the new way. This is our way because we can do this, because we're in good enough condition because we're in good enough condition, we're in good enough mental condition that we believe that we will outlast them in the fourth quarter with our starters. And Hartnstein only came out last night because he got in foul trouble. He always gets in foul trouble. But if Fibito had his dream game, I think he'd

Speaker 24203.02s - 4217.54s

play all five of them 48 minutes because he believes in they're my best players. There are minutes on an average increased about seven more minutes than the regular season. They're starters. Yeah. It's not really a whole lot. Oh, I disagree.

Speaker 54217.84s - 4227.86s

Seven minutes, seven playoff minutes is different. That's what they've been doing the entire playoffs compared to the regular season. I understand the change of pace, Rick. I get it. Yeah. But they've been doing it entire playoffs compared to the regular season. I understand the change of pace, Rick. I get it. But they've been doing it.

Speaker 44227.96s - 4231.04s

Like Skip is saying, it's like we are

Speaker 24231.04s - 4233.4s

mentally prepared

Speaker 54233.4s - 4234.94s

to do this.

Speaker 24235s - 4237.56s

Look, I understand

Speaker 54237.56s - 4240.8s

that they are doing something remarkable

Speaker 24240.8s - 4242.6s

and I want to believe

Speaker 54242.6s - 4267.34s

I don't want to believe that fatigue is going to determine the series. I want to believe, like I don't want to believe that fatigue is going to determine the series. I want to believe that, first of all, you just, you appreciate that Thibodeau and the Knicks approach the game this way, right? How can you not enjoy guys who want to play every minute, want to play hard in this day and age of load management and all of that, right?

Speaker 44267.64s - 4270.68s

Yeah. It's, I, I would love to see it happen.

Speaker 54271.3s - 4284.8s

But I'm just looking at the game today and what Indiana is doing and the intelligence of Rick Carlisle to say, you know what, Tibbs, I know how you approach things. And I'm going to take the thing that makes you great.

Speaker 34287.02s - 4287.12s

And I'm going to make you pay for it.

Speaker 54288.38s - 4288.9s

He was trying last night. I'm stressing it.

Speaker 34289s - 4289.98s

Yeah. Right? Mm-hmm.

Speaker 54290.04s - 4303.38s

And so the one element that I have is that they don't have that guy that I trust to close. That is the point.

Speaker 34303.66s - 4310.28s

If that was there, I would laugh outright at the idea that this is going to work.

Speaker 04310.68s - 4312.7s

That's the only way that this is going to work.

Speaker 54312.82s - 4315.34s

When Obie Toppin came in, he changed the game.

Speaker 34315.44s - 4375.12s

Off the bench for the Pacers, obviously, ex-Nick. T.J. McConnell, we talked about, he changed the game. Isaiah Jackson changed the game for a while when he came in. And Ben Shepard, who's been shooting his brains out. I don't know what got into him. He came in and changed the game. Isaiah Jackson changed the game for a while when he came in, and Ben Shepard, who's been shooting his brains out, I don't know what got into him, he came in and changed the game. I justgave you four players, and Rick went to him early to say, Tibs, I'm coming for you. I got him, and I got him, and we're going to wear you down and completely out, and I thought they had them because they went upnine with ten minutes to go. And then all of a sudden, somebody's got to put their foot down and say, okay, we are going to slam the door shut. And obviously Halliburton, maybe it's because of his back, he was a complete and utter no-show in the fourth quarter. Again, zero points and zero assists.So you didn't even have impact passing the basketball. Well, that won't work because now I have to ask, who's your guy? Who is it for you? Is it Seacom? Is it Neesmith? Is it Nimhard?No, no.

Speaker 54375.54s - 4380.3s

Seahcom is probably the closest. He's the closest. Right? Because he can get to different spots.

Speaker 34381.42s - 4383.74s

He's a match-up challenge.

Speaker 54384s - 4386.6s

And I don't think he's afraid to take that shot.

Speaker 34386.84s - 4391.3s

Okay, so he made three out of five shots in the fourth quarter for eight points. It was pretty good.

Speaker 54391.36s - 4394.68s

I mean, the big part of it for me really was, you're going to put the ball in Ty's hands,

Speaker 34395.22s - 4400.08s

Tyrese Halliburton's hands, and he was sloppy with it. He was loose with it. He had three fourth quarter turns.

Speaker 54400.38s - 4404.96s

It was, like, get the ball to someone for a shot.

Speaker 34405s - 4405.66s

Maybe he's tired.

Speaker 24408.32s - 4410.82s

I didn't see that as fatigue.

Speaker 34411.04s - 4412.38s

Maybe he's fatigued.

Speaker 24412.66s - 4413.9s

That's why he hurt his back.

Speaker 54414.32s - 4415.38s

Maybe that's the case.

Speaker 24415.58s - 4417.06s

Maybe he's out of shape, Rick.

Speaker 54417.48s - 4418.04s

Just saying.

Speaker 24418.48s - 4418.7s

Yeah.

Speaker 54418.96s - 4419.28s

Okay.

Speaker 34419.44s - 4435.56s

So let's say they do get past the Pacers. Then they're going to almost certainly run into the big, bad Boston Celtics, and then it won't be a matter of how many minutes you play. It's just how good are you? You know, do you have enough to hang with them, and they don't? Yeah, I wouldn't

Speaker 54435.56s - 4440.8s

think so. Right? I wouldn't think so. Well, okay, so who's the closer for the Boston Celtics?

Speaker 34441.4s - 4444.64s

Whoever they wanted to be against them? Whoever they wanted to be.

Speaker 54445.68s - 4446.48s

Whoever they wanted to be. Boston Celtics? Yeah, whoever they slower pace. And they play a slower pace. Whoever they wanted to be. Whoever they wanted to be.

Speaker 34446.6s - 4447.12s

Boston Celtics?

Speaker 54447.18s - 4448.08s

Yeah, whoever they wanted to be.

Speaker 34448.8s - 4449.7s

That's not an answer.

Speaker 54450s - 4451.94s

That's a little bit like if you got multiple

Speaker 24451.94s - 4452.94s

quarterbacks, you don't have.

Speaker 54452.94s - 4454.28s

No, I'm saying.

Speaker 24455.58s - 4456.68s

Jalen Brown could be the closer.

Speaker 54456.78s - 4457.66s

You need, no, no, no.

Speaker 24457.78s - 4458.88s

Tailon could be the closer.

Speaker 54459.58s - 4461.2s

I agree with Rick on this.

Speaker 24461.32s - 4461.84s

I'm shaking.

Speaker 54462.14s - 4463.1s

They can just be the closer.

Speaker 24463.32s - 4464.4s

You know who's emerging?

Speaker 54464.6s - 4465.58s

They're good, man.

Speaker 24465.68s - 4467.04s

Derek White has been emerging.

Speaker 34467.2s - 4468.24s

Derek White can be...

Speaker 24468.24s - 4470.92s

They're better than these teams that they're going to play.

Speaker 34471.66s - 4474.72s

Any other three that's left outside of the Celtics, they're better than it.

Speaker 24474.8s - 4480.62s

Look, first of all, like, let's just not give any credence to the Miami Heat Series for the Boston Celtics.

Speaker 54480.62s - 4486.76s

That was a lopsided mismatch from the absolute... The fact that they gave up a game is troubling. It was. That was a lopsided mismatch from the absolute stuff. The fact that they gave up a game

Speaker 34486.76s - 4492s

is troubling. It was. And it was at Boston. Yeah, they gave him. They had wake up. That,

Speaker 44492s - 4498.18s

that to me was questionable. And when it comes down to it, I'm sorry, as much as we've seen

Speaker 54498.18s - 4506.7s

Derek White be a star, as much as Jalen Brown wants to be the go-to guy, They're going to put the ball in Jason Tatum's hands.

Speaker 44506.74s - 4507.16s

They will.

Speaker 54507.28s - 4516.38s

And say, go get it for us. And I have yet to see Jason Taylor come all the way through to win a championship in that role.

Speaker 24516.58s - 4516.9s

Okay.

Speaker 54518.44s - 4519.9s

Sue me, I need to see it.

Speaker 24520.04s - 4521.08s

You're not lying.

Speaker 54521.88s - 4527.42s

He has struggled at times, late in games to put his foot down.

Speaker 24527.62s - 4528.78s

There's no question about it.

Speaker 54528.78s - 4531.54s

And Paul Pierce always says, he's still a baby.

Speaker 34531.68s - 4533.16s

And I'm like, he's played eight years.

Speaker 24533.66s - 4535.28s

He's not a baby.

Speaker 54535.5s - 4537.44s

It's not a baby in NBA minutes.

Speaker 34537.62s - 4537.86s

No.

Speaker 54538.12s - 4539.26s

But I think he'll be fine.

Speaker 34539.92s - 4545.92s

All right, we've got to talk about the quote-unquote baby who plays the baby bull who plays for the T-Wolves.

Speaker 54546.64s - 4550.24s

Anthony Edwards says stop the Michael Jordan comparisons.

Speaker 34550.66s - 4551.74s

It makes you happy.

Speaker 24552.16s - 4553.5s

Makes you happy.

Speaker 34555.1s - 4584.78s

Here's what Anthony Edwards told Melissa Rowland of Fox Sports.com about comparing him to Michael Jordan. And I quote, I wanted to stop. He's the greatest of all time. I can't be compared to him. So, Rick, we've been going back and forth and back and forth about this because so many X-stars have compared Ant Man to a young Jordan.So please weigh in. Is that comparison fair? How is it that a 22-year-old has a better sense of NBA history

Speaker 54584.78s - 4595.46s

than all of these former players and prognosticators who are making a comparison here. I know we go with the ages, but that's

Speaker 04595.46s - 4605.94s

not really fair. We can't penalize Michael Jordan because in his day and age, we didn't do one and duns. Let's look at the comparison to the number of years in the league.

Speaker 54606.18s - 4613.02s

This is Ant's fourth year in the league. What was Michael Jordan doing his fourth year in the league?

Speaker 04613.66s - 4621.22s

He was winning league MVP. He was winning defensive player the year. He was winning his second

Speaker 44621.22s - 4630.72s

scoring title in a row. And he was leading a team that had Charles Oakley is arguably the second best player.

Speaker 04630.84s - 4631.22s

True.

Speaker 54631.3s - 4633.1s

And Brad Sellers, a starter.

Speaker 34633.54s - 4634.34s

Very good points.

Speaker 54634.34s - 4640.34s

To the second round of the playoffs where they ran into the behemists that are the Detroit Pistons.

Speaker 34640.7s - 4648.4s

So what I hate about this is that I love watching Anthony Edwards play.

Speaker 54649.1s - 4717.18s

And I think he has tremendous, tremendous potential. But in no way, shape, or form should we be comparing him to Michael Jordan. We were fortunate enough to get a Kobe Bryant, who was the closest thing that we could ever hope to see to Michael Jordan. And we are not going, we were that, we were lucky to get that. We are not going to see that again. So let's not be so lazy as to put Anthony Edwards in that box. I don't have a clear comparison for him because he's, first of all, he doesn't haveMichael Jordan's demeanor. He's more Magic Johnson when it comes to that. Dwayne Wade's body, he has some of Michael Jordan's game. He's not the maestro that Michael Jordan is in terms of orchestrating the entire game. They're just, they're, they're too different to take one thing that might be alike and say he's the next Michael Jordan. You, I know you are going to struggle with that take because it was strong.

Speaker 24717.18s - 4735.26s

No, I pause for a minute, Rick, because what do we compare? See, what happens to many people is they compare the finished product of six championships, six MVP's, to the tennis shoes. I'm Michael Jordan. I walk in a roomif it's dark is going to light up.

Speaker 44735.44s - 4740.92s

You can't do that. You just can't. Agree. You cannot do that. Agree. You have to

Speaker 24740.92s - 4834.38s

look at the first four years of one's career. Yep. Yes, Michael Jordan won defensive player at a year. Michael Jordan was the MVP. He was a rookie of the year.He had, by the end, four all-star games and all. You can look at it from that standpoint. But, however, that young man that we just watched last night has a lot of similarities to Michael in his game. A whole bunch of them, whether it's to turn around, getting doubled, all of a sudden he turned around, boom, that looked like Kobe to me, which looks like Michael to me. Whether it's I'm falling to the ground, I got foul, but I'm going to fall to the ground. I'm going to double clutch it,and I'm going to still be able to stay in the air when everybody else is on the ground and knock the shot down. That's Michael. You can't run from that. Also, I'm going to duck on your ass. That's Michael.You can't run from that. Now, all of a sudden, I need to knock down a dagger. That's Michael. That's where the comparisons come in. Don't think about the finished product. Don't think about six championships.There's just different things in his game that you look at and you go, well, that's just like Michael did. Michael would have done that. Kobe would have done that. I mean, yeah, his body type is a, he's a little thicker than Michael, you know. Michael was a little skinnier, a little rangier.

Speaker 34834.46s - 4836.46s

Didn't play stronger than Michael did, though.

Speaker 24836.94s - 4839.56s

Hasn't played stronger than Michael always did.

Speaker 34839.56s - 4840.72s

What do you mean by that, Skip?

Speaker 24840.98s - 4844.82s

Just pure, raw, natural-born strength.

Speaker 34847.68s - 4847.98s

Michael Jordan was a force of nature,

Speaker 24854.32s - 4864.84s

even as baby Jordan back in his first couple of years. I think, first of all, this kid didn't go four years in college, three years at college. Right. Okay, he was on a team in Georgia that won like five games in the SEC. They were five and 13. Come on, stop. Right? And so he didn't, his deal was.

Speaker 34864.96s - 4867.76s

And by the way, he made 29% of his threes in college.

Speaker 24867.76s - 4870.78s

Yeah, because guess what I was thinking about doing? I'm trying to get to the money.

Speaker 34871.28s - 4876.46s

I'm supposed to just get on campus to the gym, shoot around, do that.

Speaker 24876.5s - 4877.68s

I ain't even thinking about the library.

Speaker 34878.16s - 4879s

Missed me with it.

Speaker 24879.06s - 4908.16s

I don't, where's it at? I'm not worried about. I'm getting in and getting out. So his skills was not refined the same way Michael's was for three years in college. Agreed. So you're going to get some little bit of, I would say, unfinished young player right now than with Michael.Yeah, Michael drugged those players to the second round of the playoffs. But it's not like Ant, man, God. I mean, he got Carl Anthony Towns. Oh, no.

Speaker 54908.2s - 4924.68s

And he got Rudy. Come on. He's got a roster. Let me say. He's got a nice roster. He got called Anthony Towns.He's got Rudy Gobert. But he's the one out there putting the daggers in everybody. He's the one that we watch it. Because if he wasn't on his team and they was going to say, playing the Nuggets, we wouldn't watch this game. You know that, Rick.

Speaker 24924.82s - 4925.58s

Here's the distinction. We would be treated like the Cleveland game. You know that, Rick. Here's the distinction.

Speaker 54925.8s - 4929.14s

We would be treating like the Cleveland Calf in Orlando Magic game.

Speaker 24929.24s - 4936.08s

Here's the distinction for me is that the Minnesota Timberwolves are putting it on a plate and Anthony Edwards is finishing the meal.

Speaker 54936.78s - 4936.94s

Yeah.

Speaker 24937.14s - 4939.14s

Michael Jordan made the meal.

Speaker 54939.64s - 4940.56s

He plated it.

Speaker 24941.02s - 4944.42s

He got everybody in their position and he closed it.

Speaker 54944.42s - 4954.14s

Like the everything that Michael did, can Anthony Edwards get there? Yeah, I think he can. But stop saying everything Michael did. This is why I just said.

Speaker 24954.2s - 4989.3s

But this is why I'm saying. This is why I went. This is why I went four years versus four years. I'm look, I'm just looking at the fourth year. I'm looking at Michael Jordan's fourth year in the league and what he did and what Ant is doing in his fourth year because I don't remember us making, I don't remember us making these comparisons prior to this year. Skip. Now they've come up. But think about why they come up because of theplayoffs. Yes. We're only talking about really the playoffs. We can go the whole year if you want to, but really it's the playoffs where this conversation has taken steam. I agree.

Speaker 04989.44s - 4996.12s

It's the playoffs. That's what's inspired it. And when you look at the numbers in the playoffs, it's pretty Jordanish.

Speaker 24996.44s - 5000.78s

I mean, just saying, you look at the numbers in the playoffs, that's like Georgia.

Speaker 35001.02s - 5011.84s

Skip, can you help you out? I know y'all hate the – look, I've tried to tell you, I've tried to warn you, I've tried to back you down. You can't. You can't even start with this.

Speaker 05011.84s - 5012.34s

It's not true.

Speaker 25012.34s - 5013.8s

It's so unfair to this kid.

Speaker 05014.48s - 5026.92s

And I'm actually surprised he said, stop it, because I love his confidence. Of course you said that. Yet the story points out, he didn't follow Jordan's career, so he's not in tune with it. He doesn't know the numbers.

Speaker 35027.82s - 5029.3s

He doesn't, he didn't watch him.

Speaker 25029.3s - 5030.94s

Anybody was he even bored with him, too?

Speaker 35031.06s - 5032.16s

No, no.

Speaker 25033.06s - 5037.38s

And he says he's not interested in being the face of the league, but he's on his way.

Speaker 35037.5s - 5042.5s

I'll give you that. But, I mean, we're talking about six championships with six finals MVP.

Speaker 25042.5s - 5055.34s

Stop that, that's ridiculous. I know, but it's just so unfair to even start with his kids. Stay in the fourth year of the playoffs, big dog. Stop going to the end. Because nobody will beat Michael with the six championships and six MVP's.

Speaker 35055.34s - 5097.84s

This will never happen. They did lose two games to the Nuggets this year in the regular season. And in those two games, he failed to score a single point in both fourth quarters.Just for the record, we still got so far to go. We got so much we need to see. They have taken Denver by storm. They have shell-shocked them. They have blindsided them. And they don't know what hit them.And maybe they're going to figure it out before Friday night. And then we'll start to see. But we got a long, long way to go this year because he just got through one round in a couple of games. And they're highly impressive. And I give you, especially game one, he hit a dagger on them. It put him up 11,

Speaker 25097.96s - 5101.92s

but it was a dagger. He drained the three and a four quarter, even though they were up.

Speaker 55102.04s - 5106.06s

Okay. But he knocked it down and he gave you to Jordan Strug. I mean, come on the right

Speaker 35106.06s - 5108.12s

track. It was. Like, you're up

Speaker 55108.12s - 5110.08s

20. You knocked down a

Speaker 35110.08s - 5111.94s

three in that situation. It's not the same as you're

Speaker 55111.94s - 5114.12s

down by two and you hit that dagger

Speaker 35114.12s - 5116.16s

three. There is a difference. And I'm

Speaker 55116.16s - 5118.2s

not saying that Ant is incapable

Speaker 35118.2s - 5119.68s

of doing any of that.

Speaker 25120.14s - 5122.1s

But it is grossly

Speaker 55122.1s - 5124.16s

unfair to the kid because you know how this

Speaker 05124.16s - 5125s

goes. I understand.

Speaker 55125.76s - 5136.26s

We said it. He's Michael Jordan. And then somehow Denver comes back and wins this series. Oh, no, he's not. No, he's not. Well, is that ants fault?No.

Speaker 15136.26s - 5137.44s

It's not the ant's fault.

Speaker 25137.44s - 5142.26s

Can we just slow down and not?

Speaker 15142.9s - 5156.78s

And honestly, I do feel it's a lazy comparison because there are some elements that are comparable. But there are just as many elements that are comparable to Dwayne Wade, for example.

Speaker 55157.24s - 5160.86s

But it doesn't have the sexiness of saying he could be the greatest ever.

Speaker 25161.06s - 5166.06s

I've never seen Dway dunk on nobody like he did them dudes the other day. I feel like we're

Speaker 55166.06s - 5172.14s

starved. We're starved for that next great American player and Anthony Edwards

Speaker 25172.14s - 5180.62s

is the closest thing we've seen to it. And so now we're jumping the gun and saying he could be it. Jall was pretty good until he got in trouble. Yeah.

Speaker 55181.26s - 5183.9s

He was pretty good. He got in trouble. Then he got hurt.

Speaker 25184.42s - 5185.5s

Yeah. So can we just? I got in trouble. Then he got hurt. Yeah.

Speaker 55186.64s - 5187.44s

So can we just?

Speaker 25190.22s - 5194.48s

I'm only comparing the four years of playoffs and what I see from a skill standpoint. That's all I'm looking at.

Speaker 55194.48s - 5209.42s

I'm just comparing the 40. When he's going to the cup again and he gets filed and he's falling and he's falling down and everybody else is on the ground, but he's still in the air. That's Jordan. You know what? Here we have two journalists or former journal or whatever,

Speaker 25209.78s - 5212.62s

and we have the athlete who's doing the narrative.

Speaker 05213.46s - 5216.66s

No, I'm just giving you what I see.

Speaker 25216.82s - 5217.54s

There's no narrative.

Speaker 55217.78s - 5222.96s

Y'all don't want it because y'all cover Jordan and y'all afraid to compare him because he looks what?

Speaker 25223.36s - 5226.26s

He looks in ways he looks like Michael Jordan.

Speaker 55226.74s - 5227.14s

Yes.

Speaker 25227.54s - 5227.76s

Yeah.

Speaker 35228.2s - 5237.28s

Stay away for the six championships. It doesn't make him Michael Jordan. Kobe wanted to be Jordan in every way, shape, and form down to the walk and the tongue.

Speaker 55237.88s - 5238.82s

And still didn't get there.

Speaker 25238.82s - 5239.82s

The chewing the gum.

Speaker 55240.12s - 5243.64s

Well, he didn't get there because he didn't win six championships and six finals and all those sort of things.

Speaker 35243.76s - 5243.88s

Okay.

Speaker 55244.28s - 5247.06s

But let me know when, let me know when Ants won one.

Speaker 25247.22s - 5247.94s

New York. Do you do that way?

Speaker 15248s - 5255s

Is that, is that, is, am I asking too much to say, just let him get to a championship and have a ring?

Speaker 25255.46s - 5265.24s

But that's not the way this. Y'all been in this business. It's not the way the business goes. If you were not having this conversation about him looking like Jordan, what would you be saying? Oh, it's a nice guard. He was a good player.

Speaker 35265.34s - 5267.76s

No, this is what makes it interesting.

Speaker 25268.42s - 5270.92s

Kishan, is there some resentment of Jordan?

Speaker 35271.16s - 5277.38s

Is it starting to build the people, like ex-athletes, the KGs of the world, like KG's

Speaker 15277.38s - 5280.1s

all over this kid saying, there he is, baby Jordan.

Speaker 25280.4s - 5283.42s

But it's the, it's not the six championships.

Speaker 35283.8s - 5286s

Y'all got to stop thinking about the six championships.

Speaker 25286s - 5286.8s

I know.

Speaker 35286.9s - 5287.92s

Just think about the playoffs.

Speaker 25288.06s - 5298.78s

Think about the two series that we've seen so far, the sweep that he just did a week ago, and the 2-0 up right now against the defending world champions and some of the things that he's been able to do.

Speaker 55298.96s - 5304.26s

How about we just go fourth year versus fourth year? He wasn't Anthony Edwards.

Speaker 25304.52s - 5319.08s

No, because we wasn't having this conversation in. We wasn't having the conversation in December. He looks like Jordan. We're only talking about it now. Because in these playoffs, that's stuff that Jordan would do. That's all.That's all we're saying.

Speaker 55319.08s - 5325.88s

I don't think we're just saying he looks like Jordan in these playoffs. I think we're saying he looks like Jordan, period. You guys are unbelievable. All right. We got to talk about that other team in these playoffs. I think we're saying he looks like Jordan, period. You guys are unbelievable.

Speaker 35326s - 5334.06s

All right, we got to talk about that other team in Los Angeles. The poor Clippers, they want to run it back. Uh-oh.

Speaker 45340.78s - 5343.66s

Clippers GM Lawrence Frank says the team

Speaker 35343.66s - 5347.2s

wants to bring back Paul George and James Harden.

Speaker 45347.8s - 5351.92s

Nick Kauaizen-flamed knee is quote-unquote big picture minor.

Speaker 35352.72s - 5354.14s

So here we go again.

Speaker 45354.4s - 5356.06s

Rick, what are you hearing?

Speaker 35356.28s - 5359.02s

What are you thinking about next year's clippers?

Speaker 55359.22s - 5478.42s

Yeah, I'm hearing the same in terms of what they want to do. Part of this is because those guys came to the clippers to play together. And if you pull the thread and you let one of them go, there's a question as to how the others are going to feel about wanting to stay as well. I believe, however, it is a matter of we don't have better alternatives. As much as I don't believe in this combination because I don't have that guywho can close games, who I trust is the decision maker at the end of games when you get into ISO or can make other guys better. Every one of those guys has to have the ball in their handsto be at their best. And so what happens is whoever you give the ball to, they become very predictable. This is who's going to try to get it on his own. And they just haven't been able to win that way because the other guys aren't threats off the ball. So it's a matter of where can we get that guy, where can we get a guy that we could bring in that these guys will, that we can put the ball in his hands,and he's going to be the decision maker at the end of games. I don't know that that guy exists in the league right now. So the alternative is to say, let's keep the band together and see if somehow we can stay healthy and someone's going to mature.James Hardin is not going to disappear. Paul George is not going to turn the ball over. Kwai Leonard is going to stay healthy and be available because the alternative is we can't find the missing piece out there. But do I believe in it? No. I announced that I was stepping off of the Los Angeles Clippers trainat the beginning of this year. I had seen it in enough times where I looked at the talent. I looked at it on paper and I said, this should be one of the best teams in the league. And yet time after time after time they fall short.

Speaker 15478.64s - 5481.56s

At some point, you just have to accept they are who they are.

Speaker 55483.12s - 5483.56s

Okay.

Speaker 15484.44s - 5487.56s

I'm not a Clipper fan, Skip, by no stretch of the imagination.

Speaker 35488s - 5489.62s

Clipper Kishon, that you are.

Speaker 15489.8s - 5490.22s

However.

Speaker 35490.58s - 5492.86s

You do love your four SoCal guys, though.

Speaker 25493.02s - 5541.28s

Yeah, however, they are going to run it back and bring it back. Everybody's coming back to the party. Tailu, all of them, they get their money. Now, whether or not Kauai gets a 221 extension versus a little bit less, whatever, but they're coming back. And the reason that you talk about they haven't been as good as advertised,no, they really have. They were the fourth C this year. I mean, how much higher, you know, could you go? The problem that they have is much like you said, Rick, it's the big H word, health. Kauai fell apart right on schedule, right at the right time when they're rolling into theplayoffs. If he's healthy, if you get the healthy Kauai Leonard, and you talk about the guy who's the clothes of the dagger, all those sort of things, it's Kauai Leonard. They got the guy.

Speaker 05541.28s - 5545.2s

The problem is he can't help the club in the tub.

Speaker 25545.42s - 5561.42s

So they got to figure out how to figure that knee out, whatever it is, is bothering him. They got to figure that out. Because when they were on the court together, man, they were something to be wrecked. There was a stretch right there. They were the best team in the NBA.

Speaker 55562.34s - 5563.36s

Yeah, they were the best team in the NBA.

Speaker 25563.86s - 5595.48s

But the health is the major issue. When they were on the floor together, you didn't need to move James Hardin from the three to the two or even the one. He could stay at the three and be just doing what he was doing. And they were 20-something and five doing what he was doing. Then the moment that Kauai got hurt, he got slid into a different role, so to speak, right, Rick? And then it was like, oh, God.Then he had the one game, obviously, I was like, oh, yeah, we're rolling. And then the last two games against Dallas, it was kind of like right on time again

Speaker 45595.48s - 5599.72s

for everything that Skip has been preaching, and Paul Pierce had been preaching about

Speaker 25599.72s - 5623.26s

James not being able to live up to those late playoff season kind of negative output, so to speak. You know, but I think this team, you know, I think if they could stay, it's the if, they could stay healthy. If they could have just stayed healthy throughout the playoffs, we would still be talking about them today.

Speaker 35623.26s - 5629.82s

Look, Kishon, I love Kauai. I do not love and have never loved his fragility because he

Speaker 25629.82s - 5636.9s

just fragile. And I can't explain it. This came out of nowhere. He suddenly had an infection

Speaker 35636.9s - 5649.78s

in his knee for no apparent reason that they can figure out it got infected. And long term, it should be no big deal, but are you going to trust that he's going to be there for you next year? You have to playoff times because you're stuck.

Speaker 15650.02s - 5651.46s

You already gave him the deal.

Speaker 05651.62s - 5652.38s

You gave him the deal.

Speaker 35653.3s - 5719.14s

Can he overcome a James Harden and a Paul George in the biggest playoff moments because I'm going to be harsh with this, but they both have in the biggest playoff moments, loser intangibles to me. Low basketball character when it matters the most. When you most need to trust them, you cannot. And we don't have enough show for me to walk you through all the moments, all the epic fails on both their parts, but especially on James's parts.And Kishon, you weren't here yesterday, so I'm going to hit you with just one small detail. If we just look at the two games he played last year for the Philadelphia 76ers against Boston, it was game six and seven. They're up three to two with a home game in game six, and then they had to go to Boston for game seven.Let's take those two, and let's take this year's two biggest games. It's game five at home. You're tied two to two with the Dallas Maverage, two to two at home, and then you have to go to them for game six. I'm going to take those four games for James Hardin, and I'm going to total up what he did in those four crucial games.

Speaker 25720.02s - 5724.98s

He shot two for 24 from three in those four games. Two for two, that's eight percent.

Speaker 35724.98s - 5725.64s

I mean, it's eight percent.

Speaker 25726.7s - 5729.18s

I mean, it's just ridiculous. I don't need you to remind me that.

Speaker 35733s - 5733.42s

From the floor, he shot 14 of 65.

Speaker 25734.88s - 5771.86s

That's 22%. He should move to Vegas and become a disappearing magic act. Now you see him, now you don't, because that's what he does. He disappears. Right on schedule. And Paul George is a really good guy. And I love his sort of just his off-the-court character.But man, when it's time, when these two needed to rise and shine and pick up slack for Kauai, they just can't do it. And that may be the case, Skip. Maybe James Hardin is not in that position or that role where he can do that, okay? Maybe if he was just the guy at the three for them, the three spot for them, we wouldn't

Speaker 35771.86s - 5786.7s

be having these problems. Maybe he's more comfortable. Now, all of a sudden, he gets pushed up and he just collapsed. And maybe that's the case. After their game five loss, I'm watching Barclay and Shaq, and they're blasting Paul George for how blasé he was after the

Speaker 45786.7s - 5796.34s

game. It's no big deal. We'll get him in game six. He doesn't seem to take it that seriously. It's kind of his nature and his attitude. Go ahead. But who does? The Clippers.

Speaker 35797.46s - 5802.6s

Who does? I'm not a Clipper fan, so I... But this is my issue. Like, even if Kauai is healthy,

Speaker 45803.36s - 5805.36s

Kauai is not a leader.

Speaker 35807s - 5808.48s

He's not a guy who rallies. There's nothing vocal about him.

Speaker 55808.64s - 5809.52s

And at some point...

Speaker 35809.52s - 5812.78s

I don't need Kauai to do that because I got Westbrook, so I'm good.

Speaker 25814.12s - 5814.94s

Russ is coming off.

Speaker 35815.18s - 5818.16s

But he's coming off the bench, all of that, though, Rick.

Speaker 25818.44s - 5823.06s

But in the end, his voice speaks volumes regardless to where he's at on the debt.

Speaker 35823.06s - 5828.34s

What I need is someone who speaks and also is composed to say,

Speaker 55828.52s - 5831.24s

this is how we're going to do it in this situation.

Speaker 25831.68s - 5835.42s

And Russ, yeah, we'll give you the fire, but he doesn't give you the reins.

Speaker 55836.22s - 5840.64s

And that's what's always been missing is that when they hit a bump in the road,

Speaker 35841.42s - 5847.34s

who gathers them and says, this is how we're going to play to get through this.

Speaker 55847.44s - 5849.14s

That's why they can have these big leads.

Speaker 25849.32s - 5852.08s

They can show you how dynamic and explosive they can be.

Speaker 35852.38s - 5860.62s

And then they just get walked down, which is what the Dallas Maver, the Dallas Mavericks did to them, what the Denver Nuggets did to the Los Angeles Lakers.

Speaker 55860.62s - 5863.86s

Like, you know what, you can go ahead up by 20, 25.

Speaker 35864.02s - 5868.18s

32 at 1. But you know what? We're go ahead up by 20, 25. 32 at 1. But you know what? We're going to get back in this. Yeah.

Speaker 55868.46s - 5869.72s

Because we can execute.

Speaker 35869.72s - 5882.9s

And by the way, Kishan, the athletic reported that getting Russ to come off the bench was no walk in the park for tie. It was no. Behind the scenes, it was. I heard that that was just a bunch of nothing, but okay.

Speaker 25883.06s - 5885.66s

Okay. Well, Russ posted that it was a bunch of nothing.

Speaker 55885.7s - 5887.52s

Oh, did he? Okay, see, there you go.

Speaker 35887.64s - 5888.56s

Well, there you go.

Speaker 55890s - 5891.46s

I heard it was a bunch of nothing.

Speaker 35891.54s - 5892.08s

I'm just saying.

Speaker 55892.38s - 5894.44s

All right, let's talk about something happier.

Speaker 35895.14s - 5903.1s

How about Wimby running away with Ricky the Year? Are we witnessing the dawn of the greatest player ever? Hichon says yes.

Speaker 05903.1s - 5905.5s

Oh, man. I thought that was Anthony ever.

Speaker 35905.62s - 5906.46s

Yeah. What?

Speaker 05908.46s - 5912.68s

No surprise.

Speaker 35912.92s - 5931.46s

Wimby, one rookie of the year, unanimously got all 99 first place votes. Chet Holmgren finished second, got all but one second place vote. So, Rick, can you make a case this was the greatest rookie year ever, or even a case that we just watched the first year of the greatest player ever?

Speaker 55931.8s - 5937.42s

I cannot make a case that this was the greatest rookie of the year.

Speaker 45937.84s - 5938.3s

Year.

Speaker 55940.34s - 5942.6s

Blake Griffin coming in, Damien Liller,

Speaker 45942.68s - 5946.92s

we have a number of other guys who had comparable years.

Speaker 55947.42s - 5998.16s

But when it comes to how we're seeing the dawn of the greatest player ever, yes, I can make that case. I've never seen the combination of skill, size, athleticism, speed, maturity, intelligence. And it's not just the combination and the combination early. It truly is at freakish levels to see him grow the way he did over the course of this year at 19. And even with Blake Griffin and Damien Lillard and Alan Iverson and LeBron James,those guys were surrounded by veteran players their first year as they grew. This guy was, in some ways, the veteran because of experience playing over in Europe.

Speaker 45999.42s - 6002.54s

And yet the growth that he had

Speaker 56002.54s - 6037.58s

and the things that he did, and you heard it from players. Like, we don't know what to do with this. And this is at the very beginning. So, look, health-wise, to me, it's just a matter of how long does it take San Antonio to put the right pieces around him? But with everything that he has, and as great as LeBron was coming in and what he had, the combination of skills and size and athleticism, this guy's on another level and already has the maturity in his game.

Speaker 46038.58s - 6044.7s

The sky is the limit for this kid from what I have seen to this point.

Speaker 56044.78s - 6047.24s

If he stays healthy, I don't see there's any stopping him.

Speaker 26047.8s - 6059.14s

Yeah, as far as the rookie goes, there's only one guy that I can point to when you say the greatest rookie season of all time. It's Magic Johnson. Dude, won the NBA championship, Ben.

Speaker 16059.18s - 6059.76s

That's a good point.

Speaker 36059.76s - 6060.18s

Great point.

Speaker 56060.22s - 6060.58s

Come on.

Speaker 36060.72s - 6071.42s

With an all-star game, NBA championship coming off the NCAA championship. I guess, yeah. So now you say, all-star game, NBA championship coming off to NC2A champion. I guess, yeah. So now you say, well, you know, Magic obviously was the floor general.

Speaker 26071.74s - 6077.5s

He won against the sixes. He jumped in the game. When Karim got hurt, he took it over. He did. So we could put the rookie stuff aside.

Speaker 46078s - 6088.02s

Now when you talk about the future, this dude, if he could gain some weight, some muscle, you don't know what you're really looking at.

Speaker 26088.4s - 6097.78s

Because if you think about all of big, so to speak, when you talk about way back in history, Will Chamberl, he got thicker, bigger, stronger.

Speaker 46097.96s - 6098.38s

He did.

Speaker 26098.56s - 6101.18s

You know, Kareem got bigger, thicker, stronger over time.

Speaker 16101.64s - 6108.16s

Our guys in San Antonio, they both got bigger. David Robinson, along with Tim Duncan, they got stronger, bigger.

Speaker 46108.66s - 6110.06s

So if he can do that,

Speaker 16111.88s - 6112.26s

just

Speaker 26112.26s - 6146.5s

his size along, his ability to shoot the three, put the ball on the floor, create his own shot, all of those sort of things, his length, like there's no, I don't understand anybody.I don't know who could guard him if he does the things that I'm talking about. He's just going to be out there playing like at a high school. That's what it's going to look like. It really is. Because even now at times, you look at you go, like I told you what day, we was watching Skippen. Unlike Chet, they challenge him.They don't really challenge him. They'll go to the cup and see him and go, that's probably not a good idea,

Speaker 36146.66s - 6180.1s

and run back out and pass the ball. Yeah. They're going to get rid of it because he's just standing there waiting for you to shoot. Even if you get a step on himand you get past him and he's at the free throw line, you still, I've seen guys kind of looking to see where he's at before they go to lay it up. Correct.They don't know where he is, but if he's around here somewhere, I better not take it. Man, I've seen him block a shot from the other side of the other side of the block. He was on the other side of the block. He turned around. The dude wouldn't make a layup. He just wouldn't block it. Like, it's just, it's a weird.It's weird.

Speaker 26180.1s - 6199.32s

It's like the Loch Ness monster. Spider-Man. He might just rise up out of the water and eat you when you least expect. It's like all the stranger things. So I don't know where his career, you know, is going to end and be great. Now, obviously, you've got to win some championships.But he certainly, as far as his ability, he's headed in the right direction.

Speaker 36199.78s - 6244.76s

Okay. So I look at the accolades. I look at he averages. 21-11, four assists, which is pretty good. And obviously, four blocks is pretty great. And I look at all these other accolades.First rookie ever to, he'll probably be the first rookie to make first team all defense. No one's ever done that before. He met 128 three-pointers. Not a great three-point shooter, especially early struggle. But he became the first player in NBA history. We had 250 blocks and 100 plus three-pointers, not a great three-point shooter, especially early struggle, but he became the first player in NBA history. We had 250 blocks and 100 plus three-pointers. So the combinationof the blocks and the threes, and the three-point motion is as pure as you can teach it. It's textbook. It looks like it'll work, and it's only going to get better. So there's only one thing

Speaker 56244.76s - 6246.22s

that's stuck in my crawl all year,

Speaker 36246.26s - 6252.84s

and I told you this. First, he used to camp out at the three-point line. I said, just go stand under there. They can't deal with you.

Speaker 46253.34s - 6258.88s

But this got me about the San Antonio Spurs coached by one of the greatest coaches ever

Speaker 36258.88s - 6359.68s

in Greg Popovich. It baffled me how they could finish 22 and 60. They lost 60 games with this kid playing most of the games. And that took a close late where they won three of their last four, excuse me, three of their last four. And remember, the shock of the year was on the Friday night before the season ended.It might have been the first indication for these Denver nuggets that they weren't quite right. Because remember, they went to San Antonio when all they had to do was beat Wimby and the Spurs to wrap up the top seed in the West. And they lost 100 to 98. And I didn't even know. I forgot about the game. And I saw it Saturday morning.I said, what? They lost. They lost the one seed to the thunder who were about to talk about in a minute. But I couldn't figure out how the numbers I just read to you didn't have more impact on the scoreboard. And you can say, well, they were terrible and they had the cells pretty good to me.And Sohan can be pretty good. I watch them a lot. Used to be a big Spurs fan when it was Duncan Parker, Schobley. But he has yet to have real scoreboard impact yet. And I don't know why, because obviously Chet got dropped into a much better situation.But trust me, Chet makes his teammates a little better than Wimby was able to make his teammates. And you can say, well, he just doesn't have any teammates. I'm not sure about that. So that's the only, the only X factor is if I gave you those numbers, anywhere else you'd say that one man show can win you more than 22 games out of 82.

Speaker 26359.94s - 6363.76s

I don't necessarily even know that they was trying to win like that, though. And you could be right

Speaker 36363.76s - 6369.4s

about Coach Pop. I just, he wanted him to learn. He on the honeymoon, and he's just saying, I hit the lottery.

Speaker 26369.68s - 6372.22s

And I can get another lottery pick this year.

Speaker 36372.34s - 6375.58s

I can add another piece to him, what's the hurry?

Speaker 26375.68s - 6376.34s

He's 19.

Speaker 56376.58s - 6378.14s

I do believe that that was part of it.

Speaker 36378.38s - 6380.74s

But if you gave him, Shay, what would that look like?

Speaker 26380.84s - 6382.8s

If you just gave, if you, that's what I'm saying.

Speaker 36382.94s - 6388.82s

So it's like, yeah, you say, well, we could say he doesn't have any players. He doesn't have any players.

Speaker 26389.32s - 6393.08s

Vesel's pretty good, though. And he was, I forget what pick in the draft he was. He was

Speaker 36393.08s - 6400.02s

top, I don't know, was he top five? But you dealing with OKC and Chet's dealing with a guy that's

Speaker 26400.02s - 6404.22s

in the MVP conversation. No, he is. So give that to Wemby and may be different.

Speaker 56404.54s - 6410.92s

Yeah. They also, one last thing, they didn't play through Wembe all the time.

Speaker 06411.02s - 6411.22s

Nope.

Speaker 36411.9s - 6417.52s

Pop was very, I don't know, intentional in spoon-feeding him.

Speaker 06417.76s - 6420.58s

And again, to the point of not wanting to win every game.

Speaker 56420.76s - 6422.1s

They wanted to win every game.

Speaker 06422.64s - 6424.16s

Hey, he would have been seeing the ball a lot more in the fourth.

Speaker 56424.16s - 6425.46s

Do you remember when Pop said

Speaker 36425.46s - 6428.1s

the day Tim Duncan walks out that door,

Speaker 56428.18s - 6429.62s

I'll be right behind it? Yes.

Speaker 36430.14s - 6432s

That was like eight years

Speaker 56432s - 6433.88s

ago, and now he's hit the lottery with Wimby,

Speaker 36433.94s - 6435.98s

and now he's taking his time. Let's stay in

Speaker 56435.98s - 6437.54s

the honeymoon phase. The Olympic,

Speaker 36437.74s - 6439.62s

coaching the Olympic team, rejuvenated.

Speaker 56439.76s - 6440.92s

Uh-huh. There you go.

Speaker 36442s - 6443.64s

All right. Up next, why

Speaker 56443.64s - 6447.64s

I'm going college rah-rah over Luca and Kyrie.

Speaker 36447.76s - 6449.02s

I will explain in a moment.

Speaker 56455.08s - 6456.32s

Maughn't Back down.

Speaker 36458.44s - 6461.78s

Maps Thunder starts tonight in OKC.

Speaker 06461.98s - 6462.74s

Can't wait.

Speaker 36462.9s - 6465.16s

Kishan, who you got. I'm going to take OKC. Are you? I'm going to take O'KC.

Speaker 26465.42s - 6467.3s

I'm going to take O'KC.

Speaker 36467.38s - 6468.72s

Is this an anti-Luca pick?

Speaker 26468.86s - 6469.76s

It might be.

Speaker 36469.82s - 6471.28s

It might be an anti-skip pick.

Speaker 26471.28s - 6472.26s

You just never know.

Speaker 16472.5s - 6493.48s

Well, that's not true. I think when you got these young dudes, we watching it kind of happened with Minnesota, a younger team with the younger superstar, who's the leader of the team, and you got this over herewith Shea in uh chat so i like i like their chances i like them strong and it said okay c they've beaten the mavs three

Speaker 26493.48s - 6499.66s

times the she out of four yeah so i like the chances this to me is a different dallas

Speaker 56499.66s - 6508.5s

mavericks team than we saw for a good part of the season and And I like Dallas's chances of winning the series and winning game one.

Speaker 26508.5s - 6512.62s

They just came off of playing a much more formidable opponent.

Speaker 56513.54s - 6522.26s

I think Oklahoma City may have a little delusional understanding of what the playoffs are all about.

Speaker 46522.44s - 6526.34s

Because let's face it, Brandon Ingram and C.J. McCollum

Speaker 56526.34s - 6528.3s

are dramatically different

Speaker 46528.3s - 6529.1s

than facing

Speaker 56529.1s - 6555.28s

Luca Donchich and Kyrie Irving. No Zion. And No Zion. And New Orleans was a very nice regular season team, but the way they play is very similarto Oklahoma City, and Oklahoma City is just deeper and better. I think that Dallas is built to take them apart, particularly with their playoff experience.

Speaker 36556.06s - 6715.84s

Okay, you can disqualify me because I'm from Oklahoma City, but I have fallen for this team. And I like Dallas a lot, and I don't disagree with any point you just made. But I will remind you, Luke has got a knee issue that is really bothering him. He just shot one for 10 in the closeout game from three and nine of 26 from the floor.And he looked like he was laboring the whole game. Then they lost Maxi Kleba, who's a big deal to them as a guts and blue guy. He just is. He competes hard. He plays high-level defense. He makes big threes for them. He gives them those 20 great minutes that championship teams have. I think they'll miss him. Now we're back to the college rah-rah team in Oklahoma City. If Unity can win a second round of the playoff series,if camaraderie, if togetherness, of all those college rara things can work, they work. That's how they led the West with 57 wins. They literally bark like dogs to each other. And you can laugh all you want and you can scoff, but you're going to see them bark like dogs to each other. And I can laugh all you want and you can scoff, but you're going to see them bark like dogs to each other.And I love it. It does my heart good because they will not allow any single man to do a solo post-game interview. Whoever the network requests, five or six or eight of the other guys will all go out there arm in arm and be draped around him.And they'll let him speak for the most part, but they're going to be in the shot with him because they don't do solo post-game interviews. And Kishan, you can laugh at all this if you want, say it doesn't work at this level of the National Basketball Association playoffs. But they got all this going for them. They did lead the league in three-point shooting.And I know that's a dangerous stat at this time a year because you can live and die by it. See Boston. But if they continue to make their threes like they can make them, they can shoot you out of their gym for sure. And they're a top five defensive team. And Lou Dort, I wish they had two Lou Dorts because you got Kyrie and Luca, but man, you want to talk about getting up in you? He will get up in you and fight you and scratch you and claw youand just sort of infuriate you all night long. And the two Jalen Williams, one is going to be a star, and the other one plays high-level defense, the one from Arkansas, and the one from Santa Clara is just gifted. So I don't know, with giddy and they look legit to me.

Speaker 16715.94s - 6717.62s

So I'm going to give them a slight edge.

Speaker 26717.74s - 6719s

I wouldn't laugh at it, Skip.

Speaker 36719.18s - 6719.88s

You know why?

Speaker 26720.5s - 6732.02s

Because team camaraderie, no matter how you look at it, behind closed doors, or post-game interviews, whatever you call it, that's how you win championships because we trust each other, we believe in each other,

Speaker 06732.02s - 6743.84s

we're around each other, we go to dinners, all those things. They do. Think about championship teams that you,just think about championship teams for a minute, whether it's your Dallas Cowboys that won championships and everybody partied together all the time and hung out.

Speaker 46744.28s - 6749.92s

No, I'm serious. Think about Chicago, think about Chicago Bulls.

Speaker 16750.36s - 6757.82s

We now look at the difference with Michael and Pipping them, but I was there around them in the second three.

Speaker 46757.9s - 6771.1s

They used to be together all the time. So that's it. So I don't mind it at all. I think with a young team, that's good for it. The Golden State Warriors. Those guys hang out together.They go on trips together. That's what happens.

Speaker 36771.22s - 6773.28s

But in the end, talent's going to prevail.

Speaker 26773.6s - 6776.14s

You know, in the end, talent will prevail.

Speaker 36776.14s - 6780.32s

But as my old coach would say, you are what your record say you are.

Speaker 26780.36s - 6784.76s

And it says they won 57 and lost whatever it was, 25, yeah.

Speaker 36784.94s - 6786.34s

Agreed. I would say, though,

Speaker 26786.38s - 6792.76s

that the Dallas Mavericks have cultivated that same lottery. I agree. And it's special to see

Speaker 56792.76s - 6798.92s

someone like Kyrie, who hasn't always had that for a variety of reasons, sometimes self-inflicted,

Speaker 36798.92s - 6808.38s

to now enjoy what is happening right now. And allowing us to enjoy watching him play where we're not distracted

Speaker 56808.38s - 6819.08s

by all of the other stuff and we just get to appreciate how unique his game is and that he appreciates

Speaker 36819.08s - 6826.52s

playing alongside a guy like lucca donchitz and on the flip side, Luca is utilizing the players around him.

Speaker 56826.6s - 6828.06s

For the first time. I agree.

Speaker 06828.06s - 6833.48s

That is when they are truly dangerous when he's doing that. And if he continues to do that,

Speaker 56834.14s - 6836.82s

then I give them the edge because of their experience.

Speaker 06837.04s - 6841.02s

Final point. If they're Warnowimby, we'd be looking at Chet saying,

Speaker 56841.22s - 6850.26s

you know what, he's pretty good. And he is pretty good. But he gets completely utterly overshadowed by this young monster in San Antonio.

Speaker 36850.56s - 6853.48s

Because Chet's not afraid.

Speaker 26853.72s - 6855.52s

He also gets overshadowed by his own teammate.

Speaker 36855.76s - 6856.76s

Well, he does.

Speaker 26857.3s - 6858.3s

But he is special.

Speaker 16858.6s - 6858.92s

All right.

Speaker 26859.2s - 6859.74s

We'll take him.

Speaker 36860s - 6860.82s

Okay, up next.

Speaker 26860.92s - 6874.2s

Good tonight. Be yet another trap game for Boston in Boston. That's next. Bad sign for the calves tonight.

Speaker 36874.4s - 6887.82s

They're 12.5 point underdogs. Tonight's game one at Boston, but they might get Jared Allen back while Celtics will be without. Oh. So, Rick, you give thes any shot tonight? I do.

Speaker 56888.32s - 6892.5s

I expect if there's a game that the Cavs are going to win in this series, this is

Speaker 36892.5s - 6898.08s

the one. They're coming off of a very heated series. They're playing at a high level.

Speaker 56898.88s - 6903.6s

Boston Celtics had no competition with the Miami Heat, and they've been sitting for a while.

Speaker 36903.72s - 6907.92s

So I think this is a very getable game. I think you said it was a trap game. I think that's exactly

Speaker 26907.92s - 6925.72s

what it is. See, I don't think it's a trap game. I think that the Celtics have a lot to prove to a lot of people, so they're not going to allow what happened in Miami to steal one in game one and then got to wake up. I think they wake up tonight and saying to themselves, we've got to start off fast. We can't afford to be playing games down the stretch.

Speaker 36925.88s - 6946.7s

Yeah, this team has a short history of blowing home games. It did it last year to Miami. Yep. And if there's a game to blow, it would be this one, just because they don't take them quite seriously enough and they're not playing at their RPM just yet.If the calves can't steal this game, they're going to get swept to me.

Speaker 26946.98s - 6952.86s

That once Boston gets back in rhythm, it's just going to go haywire, and I'm not sure

Speaker 36952.86s - 6956.22s

there's high interest in this series at this point.

Speaker 26956.66s - 6958.02s

I'll watch it just because.

Speaker 16958.68s - 6959.34s

Just because.

Speaker 26959.9s - 6960.06s

Yeah?

Speaker 36960.52s - 6961.38s

I have to watch it.

Speaker 16961.56s - 6968.02s

Well, you have to watch it as the prelude to the game of the night, which is in Oklahoma City, Oklahoma, your favorite town, right?

Speaker 26970.56s - 6981.28s

All right, that is it for today's undisputed. We will back tomorrow at 9.30 Eastern to Talk Thunder Mavericks, and I can't wait.