The Goldman Alum Who Reimagined the Yankees and AC Milan

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Picture the playing field as a workplace. It's where you set goals, meet obstacles, take feedback, and dream big. And the way we show up every day matters. Whether we win or lose, you got to keep a civil. No matter your field, Sharm ORG calls you to step onto it with civility. For a better workplace and a better world.

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Bloomberg Audio Studios Podcasts, Radio News ORG. What gets me up in the morning? What do I love?

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And I love playing shadow entrepreneur, and I like solving problems with capital. And it just so happens, you know, luck in people's career. I happen to hit an like solving problems with capital. And, you know, it just so happens, you know, luck in people's career. I happen to hit an inflection point with sports that I couldn't possibly have seen coming back in 2001, right? You look back on the last 20 years and you're like, you know, luck's great. You really hit an air pocket where you took off. Now the challenge is navigating that.

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This week on the show, Alex, Jerry Cardinal, this is a guy who you and I both know. He's the founder of Redbird Capital. He's a former partner at Goldman Sachs ORG. He's had a hand in some of the most important moments in sports history over the last 30 years, including some teams you are quite

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familiar with. Very much so, the New York Yankees. And he was one of the founding partners for the great George Steinbrenner, who, when he was in his early 30s, trusted him with this incredible project to leave MSG and create his own network with the Goldman Sachs ORG and the New York Yankee brand that today exists as the most successful regional sports network of all time.

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This is one of those things that I think we take for granted these days. It's like, yeah, you want to watch the Yankees, you turn on the Yes ORG network. This was a radical, controversial to say the least idea back in the day. People were mad about this. And yet, George Steinbrenner PERSON, as was often the case, saw something that other people didn't. I think what's so interesting about Jerry Cardinal, too, is you take the Yes Network, cool, amazing. Then you start Redbird Capital ORG. That's pretty great. But then you start to list out the things that Redbird ORG has been involved in,the creation of the next look and maybe most successful version ever of the XFL with Dwayne Johnson, aka The Rock, and Danny Garcia PERSON. That's a massive bet and a really big investment. And then he goes into the business you're in now, which is owning a sports team. And he doesn't just own any sports team. He doesn't go to buy just anything. He goes for A.C. Milan, arguably, one of the top 10 franchises on the planet. And one of the things that totally caught me off guard candidly going into this,and you had given me just a little bit of a teaser about this, he had a hand in a couple of the most important moments in your life. One, getting to the New York Yankees and maybe even more importantly, winning a World Series. That's what makes Jerry

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so special. I mean, to think that he had a big hand in bringing me here in 04 from the Rangers ORG when George Steinbrenner came calling, and then more importantly, keeping me as a Yankee ORG when I opted out. And then it was a famous lunch with Randy Levine, myself, and Jerry that led to the 2009 title. On this episode of The Deal, Jerry Cardinal Let's get started with this jam.

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So introduce yourself for us. Tell us who you are, what you do.

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Jerry Cardinal, founder, managing partner of Redbird Capital ORG. And what does Redbird ORG do? Look, Redbird ORG is an investment platform that enables me to invest the way I invested most successfully at my 20-year career at Goldman Sachs ORG. So it's meant to be an investment business that solves problems with capital. I'm really a big believer in legitimacy. And I think, you know, today, everybody's got capital. Everybody's running around. There's just two few dealsfor the amount of capital chasing it. And, you know, my style has always been to start not with the deal, but start with the problem. And if you can solve the problem, inevitably, capital is a great way to solve a lot of problems, not all of them. But if you can start with that, you have a great foundation for legitimacy for what you're doing. And that's what redbird's meant to be.

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All right. So we are going to start with the deal because it's a show called The Deal WORK_OF_ART. I think we should start with yes.

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You want to start there? That's a big one. All right.

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It's revolutionary. Take us back to the creation of the Yes Network. How did it get started?

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Look, it was a hugely radical concept, and we didn't even know it was radical at the time. I mean, this was truly monetizing intellectual property at a time in the late 90s, early 2000s, when most investing in media and entertainment was around distribution. It was cable systems, it was outdoor billboards, radio stations, TV stations. No one really had ever invested in intellectual property, and today that would be just a no-brainer and everyone would get it. George Steinbrenner PERSON came calling calling and he had just broken away from Cablevision and MSG ORG. And the story he told was fascinating. And what he basically said was,I don't understand how I can be putting all the risk capital in to put these players on the field year in and year out to win a championship. And I just get paid a fee for the monetization of those games and my counterparty gets the appreciation in a stock price.

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That doesn't seem fair to me.

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When he put it that way, I mean, George was such a visionary, the light bulbs went off in our head and we were like, wow, we never really thought about it that way. I think this was like February of 2001 and we started sort of looking at, well, could we create

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our own network?

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And so make a long story short, I was a 33-year-old vice president at the time, and I started building the model. I knew nothing about sports. I was from Philadelphia, so I only knew about the Phillies ORG. I don't think I'd ever seen a Yankee game. And by September coming out of Labor Day, we basically had the outlines of what would become the Yes Network. And we signed that deal and hands shook on that September 10th, 2001. Oh, my God. And then I'll never forget, you know, the next day I was driving down the FDR FAC to come into the office to, you know, startthe next phases of this and, you know, saw that the plane hit the tower. And by the end of the week, you know, Goldman Sachs ORG did what you would expect Goldman Sachs to do. At the end of the week of 9-11, Goldman Sachs came in and backstopped. What then was the largest private equity check ever written? It's $335 million. Wow.

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And all we had was a piece of paper that said you now own 40% of the intellectual property, the New York Yankees and the New Jersey Nets, and you need to be on the air April 1st. When you talk about, you know, a crucible of having to really forge your way and I say George, you know, George is the kind of person. If you're there for him in a moment like that, he will reciprocate and be loyal to you forever.

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And that really was sort of the career moment for me. And I haven't looked back. And you've really had that partnership with the Yankee organization, the Steinbrenner PERSON family has been instrumental

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and everything I do. So, Jerry, if you take a step back, going back to MSG ORG, how far away was MSG from the Yankees and finally said, George said, enough, Jerry PERSON, let's go do this?

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Yeah, good question. You know, it wasn't so much a bid ask. The bid ask was not numeric. The bid ask was philosophical. George, he didn't articulate it in terms of equity. George wanted equity.George was a principal. You know, he's a maverick. He equity. George wanted equity. George was a principal. You know, he's a maverick. He's an entrepreneur.

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And so that was the fundamental difference. Now the world's changed dramatically. But, you know, that model of being a rights holder yourself and monetizing those rights and creating these terminal value businesses, literally I say to everybody that, you know, everything I've done, you know, over the last 30 years is really based on that moment.

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That model hasn't changed. That model where we partnered with the rights holder, in this case the Yankees ORG, they put in their intellectual property and we come in with scalable capital and a company building mentality, which is important, integrating a lot of operating skills in addition to your typical private equity skills. You know, that sort of Venn diagramming has never let me down.And it's sports, sports media, and media and entertainment. Fans are evolving in the way they want to consume this content.

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And, you know, my view in investing is no one has a crystal ball. But if you start with great intellectual property, you will be able to navigate these cyclicality and the volatility in the way technology is disintermediating the way these things are monetized. So speaking of Goldman ORG,

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like, if we could do a beat on Goldman ORG, because it is the Yankees ORG of investment banking, Wall Street,

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it's all of those things. I mean, if George Steinbrenner PERSON is not for the faint of heart, nor is Goldman Sachs ORG at that point, which you alluded to this idea of like, you're struggling for a seat at the table. Take us back to Goldman in the 90s.What was it like back then trying to sort of find your way? It's private. It's still private at that point, right? In the 90s.

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Yeah, it went public in 99. It was interesting. I joined Goldman Sachs out of Oxford, and then I did a stint for a year at a think tank in Tokyo GPE. So when I joined, you know, I wasn't one of these Wharton kids, you know, who knew that I wanted to go to Wall Street from day one, you know, and I joined and, you know, and I did a year in New York and then shipped out to Asia LOC. And it's probably the best thing that happened to me because I was able to find my setting working with these, you know, just iconic families and entrepreneurs in Asia LOC that were building their countries.And that, you know, as a 26, 27 year old kid, you know, you're not going to get away from the analytics. You're not going to get away from actually doing the work, which was very important. But to also add that exposure was huge. And it really opened my eyes to Goldman Sachs ORG. It really was a privilege to work there. And as I said, you know, we went from when I joined a very client relationship-based culture to a counterparty culture. And, you know, the firm always has to reinvent itself every year and multi-years inthe terms of the way Wall Street's evolving. I was watching an interview with Tom Brady and Belichick. And, you know, these guys, that mentality is Brady never looked at having won six

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Super Bowls when he went for the seventh, right? He was like, well, that's in the past. I'm only focused on, and that's the way Goldman ORG was. It's that same mentality. I mean, today, you know, the virtue is scale.

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You know, back then the virtue wasn't scale. If anything, the virtue was a little bit less is more.

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And that's, you know, the world's changed. And so that, and you can't just not evolve, but that makes it more challenging.

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Yeah, I love that philosophy, not wide and shallow, but narrow and deep.

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And sometimes you mention 99, you go public, all of a sudden, the scoreboard changes, and you've got to just throw more shots, not wide and shallow, but narrow and deep. And sometimes you mention 99, you go public, all of a sudden the scoreboard changes, and you got to just throw more shots, not quality shots, but just more shots. And obviously, that's what I love what you do at Redbird ORG. You know, when I think about Redbird Capital ORG and you've been so far ahead of the curve, you might be, maybe you and Michael Rubin, maybe the only two people on earth, right, that can do a partnership with the Yankees ORG and the Red Sox. And then you corral one of the only two people on earth, right, that can do a partnership with the Yankees and theRed Sox. And then you corral one of the greatest two owners of all time in Jerry Jones PERSON with Legends and George Steinbrenner PERSON. How and why?

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Well, I appreciate what you said.

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You know, Jerry PERSON is iconic as they get and I was lucky.

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I didn't know it at the time, but I was lucky to spend five days on a boat with him this was 2007 I used as an opportunity to tell him you know what one of my you know stretch for the stars moment would be and I said to him you know if if I could do it I said I would love to merge the Yankees the Cowboys and the Lakers ORG and I said you know if you did that I said I

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think you'll have Disney wow and I said I would leave Goldman ORG to go run that and you know if you know Jerry which you do that, I said, I think you'll have Disney. Wow. And I said, I would leave Goldman to go run that.

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And, you know, if you know Jerry PERSON, which you do, I mean, he just loved that. I mean, Jerry PERSON's just one of those guys that wants to, you know, Jerry looks at things with 3D glasses.

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And at that time, how old are you?

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I'm 30, 34, 35, 35, 36.

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Yeah.

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You know, so basically we started going at it, you know, for lunch and breakfast and cocktails and, you know, this five-day boat trip. And we came up for all the reasons why it couldn't be done, you know, with all the different league rules and everything else. But at the end of it, I said to him, look, Jerry PERSON, this has been unbelievable, incredibly inspirational. I said, I can't leave this boat unless you and I have an agreement that we've got something to do together. And one of the things we had come up with was that both the Yankees and the Cowboys ORG were building these state-of-the-art stadiums that had never been built before at the same time.

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Right.

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And this was going in, this was 2008, 2009.

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Economies falling apart.

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Economies falling apart.

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And I said, well, if we can't merge the Yankees and the Cowboys ORG,

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why don't we merge some of the economic streams between the Yankees and the Cowboys ORG?

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And what I said to him was that, look, you know, he was fascinated by the yes model.

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Because I think he was asked by the NFL ORG to look at what became the NFL network.

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And he was one of the guys taking the lead on that.

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And so he was asking me, like, how did you do yes?

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And he was trying to learn from that.

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I said, well, let's just keep it simple. I said, if yes was about capturing the intellectual property of the Yankees ORG and finding a way to put a multiple on that, and the Yankees and the Cowboys ORG are both building these iconic stadiums at the same time, why don't we find a way to capture the intellectual property, quote, unquote,

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of the two stadiums and find a pathway to put a multiple on that and that became legends hospitality so we basically created the economic

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engine of those two stadiums and you know at the time you know you a big piece of building stadiums was selling forward these seat licenses basically for premium seats and sweets today it's a little more challenging to do that because of technology you know and stub ORG hububhub and other ticketing platforms, you know, have enabled a la carte, just like in streaming and cable, same thing in the stadium. But back then, that was an incredibly important economic, you know, touchpoint for building these stadiums. And then, of course, you could wrap around at merchandising and hospitality and everything else that we do.

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Jerry, how much capital do you need and what's legends approximately worth today?

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Yeah. You know, great question. And a lot of the companies that we create, that sounds just that statement right there, that sounds like venture capital.

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But what's so interesting is that because I'm rooting it in intellectual property and we're solving a need for something in the case of the Yankees ORG broadcasting

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where they can own equity in the broadcast, in the case of the Yankees ORG broadcasting where they can own equity in the broadcast in the case of legends the same thing for the stadiums we're cash flow positive day one

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yes was different because we bought 40% of the intellectual property right legends was different legends you didn't really need a ton of capital because day one we were cash flow positive because you're now there's a bit of a j curve to get to those stadiums coming online while you may have a bit of a j curve it's very manageable. It's really not venture because you're rooted in intellectual properties. You have a pathway to non-binary risk terminal value. And then I look to use these as platforms and then put more money behind it and build it out from there. So today, Legends is a $2, $3 billion company. Wow. Right. You know, yes, we started in 01. By 2008, we had taken three and a half times our money out just by leveraging the cash flow. And then we sold it to Murdoch in 13 for roughly $4 billion. And then you bought it back. And then I bought it back as Redbird ORG in2019 with the Yankees, Amazon ORG, with a view that when we started, yes, it was a growth equity, very play. And when we bought it back, it was in transition. And we knew that we were going to have to transition it from linear cable to direct a consumer. But we knew going into what everyone's dealing with today and with the RSN ORG model being challenged, we knew what we had in that intellectual property. It's the same story.

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Let me ask you a very specific question about yes, which is this is literally born on September 10th going into September 11th EVENT.

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So yes, there's all of those assumptions are absolutely correct, except for a massive Black Swan EVENT event that at the moment, I think we can all agree.

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We didn't know what was going to happen in the world.

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How worried were you in that moment of, especially having convinced your partners at Goldman Sachs

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to backstop this thing? Like, was there a moment where you thought, well, this has been fun, but this isn't going to work now?

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I'll tell you about that. That's interesting. You know, Dick Parsons was the first to sign up with us. He was the CEO of Time Warner ORG at the time. And he said, look, you know, I hateons was the first to sign up with us. He was the CEO of Time Warner at the time. And he said, look, you know, I hate the concept of yes. He said, but it's the right thing to do for New York City GPE.

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Wow. And so, and that's the reason he jumped in. And it was hugely important that he did that.

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I've got to give credit to Leo Hindry too. Leo, you know, Leo was our CEO and had a great relationship with all the cable guys and Dick PERSON. And then I didn't have that oops moment that you talk about because once Dick PERSON came in, then everyone started to follow.

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How soon did that happen?

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That was pretty quick by Thanksgiving. But then we had a problem with Cablevision ORG. We couldn't get to an agreement with Cablevision in our first year. And when Giuliani stepped in to try to help his mayor, then he handed the reins to Bloomberg and Mike stepped in to try to help us spitzer was the attorney general time he jumped in to

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try to try to bridge the gap could not get it bridged and you know cable vision represented three

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eighths of our subscriber base wow even with them not coming on board the first year going back to my

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earlier point we were still cash flow meaningfully cash flow positive but it wasn wasn't anywhere that close to what I had underwritten in my model.

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And we won a very important case after a year.

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And that's when you came on board and you were on the cover of the New York Post ORG and I put it on every,

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I put on all the judges and everybody on all the lawyer's chairs to make the point about

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how important this intellectual property was.

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And the important case was that we got yes to stay on basic, the basic tier in cable. And one of our non-legalistic

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arguments was that a low-income subscriber in the Bronx living next to Yankee Stadium FAC should

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be able to see all their Yankee ORG games without having to necessarily buy a ticket. There may be too much for them. But they should be able to get it from, there is a public-private partnership between the cable industry and the community. And Yankee games in New York City GPE deserve that. And we won, and

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we won the right to stay on basic or expanded basic. This was a national thing because, you know, McCain and others in Congress were starting to push back on ESPN ORG. And even back then, this is 20-something years ago. People were talking about tiering sports on a cart.

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And I also, I'll never forget, you know, my model that I built had us at a buck 75 per subscriber per month.

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And ultimately through arbitration, we got a buck 67. Wow. So we were pretty much right there on terms. And then, you know, moment that kicked in the next year, you know, this thing was off to the races.

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And Jason, full disclosure, I've never told this to anyone, but back then, Jerry PERSON had to talk about full alignment. He has the Yankees ORG. He has Goldman Sachs ORG. He brings in the best people to run it. But he allowed me to invest a few bucks in the yes deal.So I put a few million dollars. I did extraordinary well. And to this day, I'm grateful. But he's one of the

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principles that passes the hat around. And it's always about we, not I. So clearly, you guys

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start a business relationship at some point. And a friendship. And a friendship. And a friendship.

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And I mean, my sense from talking to you, Alex PERSON, in preparing for this, is that going to him,

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you, Alex, start going to Jerry PERSON for all sorts of advice.

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Oh, yeah.

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Well, I'll give you one of the stories. And I'll never forget this because in 08, we did not make the postseason. And I was incredibly embarrassed. Jeter PERSON was embarrassed. Mariana PERSON, we were all very upset. And at that point I started talking to Jerry PERSON. I said, Jerry, we got to do something. This is notthe way we closed down the greatest stadium of all time to open a new one. And again, this is 08, 09, so the economy is not doing well. There's tremendous amount of internal pressure on House ORG Steinbrenner, a general partner. He says, okay, so how do we fix it? And I start going back and forth. He says, I'm going to set up a lunch with Randy Levine, the Yankee ORG president. And really, one of the unsung heroes in the Yankee universe doesn't like the spotlight, but Randy PERSON is a great leader of people and knows how to run a great business. So we set up this lunch at thecore club in Midtown. And I remember, or it was about a 90 minute lunch I remember I think Jerry PERSON came from his office in Goldman Sachs Randy comes from the Bronx GPE I come from my apartment and we meet there and I order a chicken Caesar salad a shrimp cocktail and a Diet Coke PRODUCT and the reason I remember that is because

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it went untouched for 90 minutes and Randy PERSON is a very intimidating person and a great guy and I

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remember I'm sitting here across from Randy and Jerry PERSON's to my left. I don't know how honest I can be. I don't know if I can be as honest with Randy as I am with Jerry PERSON. And I'm kind of... Because he's your boss. Yeah. And, you know,

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he's a lot like George Steinbler PERSON, right? And I start kind of mumbling and fumbling my words. And Jerry PERSON's like, come on, come on. You can be honest, he can take it. We created an architected in a napkin, Sisi Sabathia, Martikshara PERSON, and the one that I really pushed for was A.J. Burnett. And Randy PERSON, to his credit, is literally taking notes, notes. Long story short,

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Randy goes to work, Hal Steinbrenner PERSON, to his credit, spends almost half a billion dollars in acquisitions. So now we cut to spring training. I have to go get hip surgery. We're not drawing well in April. We're off to a poor start.I'm in Vail, Colorado GPE getting rehabbed. Mark Tickshare PERSON is getting booed. Sabathia PERSON is not off to a great start. I'm coming back. And I called Jerry PERSON. I said, Jerry PERSON, I feel bad.Is there anything I can do for the organization? Should I give money back? Should I defer money? Jerry PERSON says, stop. We don't need your money back. We need you to lead us to a world championship.We need you to be a cleanup hitter and be the best baseball player you can. I don't know if you remember that.

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And sure enough, about six months later, we're all on the field celebrating a world championship. All right, hold on. I remember.

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We've got to unpack this. We've got to unpack this big time. That's true.

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So how are you at that table? Like, what's your role at that point that you can be this connective tissue between this guy and the Steinbred PERSON? And Randy Levin PERSON, like, how does that happen?

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Look, and do you remember that story the way he does?

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Verbatim and it's 100% accurate. You know, it's just one of those things. I think when you came out of 9-11, our relationship with Steinbrenner PERSON's and Randy and the anchorization was formed out of 9-11 EVENT. And so what happened is, you know, I was always, and I was always a quirky guy at Goldman ORG. And so I didn't really fit into these roles that they want you to fit in.And so I didn't look at it as, you know, my banker in this case and my an investor in this case. I just, I just was their guy. And I knew one thing in the same way it was a privilege to work at Goldman Sachs ORG. I didn't know I was going to have this career in sports the way it's become, but I certainly knew what a privilege it was to be apprenticing at that table.

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Because, you know, what's happened over the last, you know, 25 years is, you know, I've seen everything. You know, sports is very much, as you know, Alex's happened over the last, you know, 25 years is, you know, I've seen everything. You know, sports is very much, as you know, Alex PERSON, it's a closed ecosystem.

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And really, I owe so much of my career to Steinbrenners and to Randy PERSON, you know, because they are incredibly loyal and they see everything.

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They think like Mavericks ORG and they demand loyalty and they demand world class. And I love those ingredients. I can live with that.

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And, you know, the one thing I know is never let them down. So when they ask for something, I don't even think about, you know, am I going to make money on this or anything else? I just do it because it's a privilege to be asked. And then

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inevitably guess what happens because we're all like-minded the same way? It leads to something. And it's gone on to this day and the Yankees came in with me when we bought A.C. Milan ORG.

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I'm all about arbitraging,

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you know, things. And so I'll arbitrage a dislocation in an ecosystem. I'll arbitrage incompetence and inefficiency. You know, sports is interesting because you've had this massive escalation in these valuations. And frankly, none of the people and none of the infrastructure has kept pace.

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And so what I do at Redbird ORG is I go and I close that gap. And in the process of closing that gap,

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I create these terminal value businesses that's a win for the rights holder and it's a win for us as the capital. Recently, you know, I decided to vertically integrate and become the rights holder ourselves.

Speaker 21454.96s - 1474.4s

Right. Right. And so that's an evolution. All right. We got to talk about Steinbrenner PERSON. I mean, you know, so you said you're a 33 year old guy come from Philly GPE, but you know who George Steinbrenner PERSON is. I mean, do you know enough that when that call comes in, you're a 33-year-old guy, come from Philly, but you know who George Steinbrenner is. I mean, do you know enough that when that call comes in, you're like, holy cow, it's George Stein PERSON? Like, what's your mindset when he comes to you the first time?

Speaker 11474.68s - 1522.38s

It was the first time I had ever interacted with a celebrity or someone of that stature. And the good thing is, I was a kid, so I didn't know better. Right. And so I'll never forget walking into his boardroom at the Regency Hotel in New York GPE. And there he was at the end of the table with the white turtleneck and the rings. And that was a moment where I took a deep breath.And I was like, oh, wow. I said, okay. George is very sort of disarming. And he said to me, you're a cardinal. He said, you're a lot younger than I thought you'd be. And so, you know, it's a little bit of, oh, geez, you know, I'm under the gun here.And the great thing, George and I had a wonderful relationship. I think it's because I grew up with a very tough old school Italian NORP father. And, you know, my dad basically put me on the witness stand every night at dinner, just grilled me.

Speaker 51522.82s - 1526.9s

And so I was used to a George personality.

Speaker 11526.9s - 1543.32s

I was used to someone really giving me a run for my money, being in my face, and I didn't back down. I knew that you had to be intelligent in the way you responded. You couldn't shoot from the hip. And it wasn't always easy, but he was very tough.But you know, you'd stand your ground and he respected you if you stood your ground.

Speaker 31543.32s - 1553.02s

Jerry, I have my own experiences with George and I love the man. He was unbelievable. You mentioned visionary, a numbers guy, courageous. How would you describe him?

Speaker 11553.32s - 1563.02s

You know, he has old school values, and I can say that today, 20 years later, when, you know, a lot of those old school values, you know, you can't find him anymore, right?

Speaker 31563.52s - 1565.56s

George wanted to make money. George

Speaker 11565.56s - 1570.86s

wanted to win. George was all about the bottom line, but also what was great about George, it was

Speaker 51570.86s - 1582s

how he did it that was important to him. And George, you know, was as hard driving as anybody, but he also had integrity in a way that I miss. Here's my George story. Yeah, I've died to hear this.

Speaker 31582.1s - 1586.82s

Okay, go. So George brought me in 2004, and it was a throw of my life to put

Speaker 21586.82s - 1592.84s

on pinstripes. And Brian Cashman asked me, when I received my MVP WORK_OF_ART award, as I almost got a deal done

Speaker 31592.84s - 1683.42s

with the Red Sox ORG, that fell apart. I was upset because I thought the deal would be a perfect deal for me, for baseball, Jeter against A-Rod, Yankees, Red Sox. Long story short, I sit next to Brian Cashman PERSON. He says, well, if you're willing to move to third base, maybe there's a move for us. Well, I'm not a drinker. I had a couple cocktails. And by the third cocktail, I go, are you serious about that? So that's circulated with Randy Levine and the boss. A couple weeks later, I become a Yankee ORG. I get off to a little bit of aslow start. Like most Yankees ORG, it's a lot going in. You have to adjust, fan base, media, all of that. And I get off to a struggling start and I'll never forget is around May 5th and I have a letter and it says Alex from GMS. GMS is George Steinbrenner PERSON. Literally my heart stopped. I started sweating. I go, oh man, this is not going to be good. I'm off to a bad start and he writes me the nicest letter. He goes, oh, man, this is not going to be good. I'm off to a bad start. And he writes me the nicest letter. He goes, hey, I brought you here, just like I broughtReggie Jackson PERSON, trust your talent. I believe in you. I'm counting on you was how he would have end every letter. I am counting on you. All the best, GMS PERSON. I sat down on my chair and I said, on my chair and I said, I went out that night, two home runs, the next night, four RBIs, the next night and the rest is history, and I'm off to the races. And to Jerry PERSON's point, he's a handshake guy, he's a code guy, and him believing in you, believing in Jerry's a 33-year-old, believing in Alex, me as a 28-year-old, just meant the world to me and the rest of history.

Speaker 11683.42s - 1710.34s

You know, that's such a great story. And that day I walked into that boardroom and saw him for the first time. After he, you know, he digged me a little bit about my age. He said to me, do you know why I called you in Goldman Sachs? I said, no. And he said, you know, when I was a kid and I came to New York GPE for the first time, there were very few people who would give me the time a day. And he said, Gus Levy, who was this iconic CEO of Goldman Sachs ORG, he said, he was one of the few people who gave me the time of day.

Speaker 51710.38s - 1712.28s

And he brought me in and he introduced me to people.

Speaker 11712.32s - 1719.62s

And he really helped me, you know, get my feet under me in New York City GPE. And he said, I've always been loyal to Goldman ORG as a result of that. He's very loyal guy.

Speaker 01719.82s - 1730.54s

And then it was like this moment out of a few good men. Do you remember that scene when Tom Cruise meets Jack Nicholson PERSON? And Nicholson realizes that Tom Cruise's PERSON father was his very famous, you know, judge.

Speaker 41730.54s - 1734.24s

And he said, you know, your dad is a Lionel Caffee PERSON.

Speaker 01734.28s - 1742.76s

Your dad is a legend. How is your dad? And Tom Cruise looks and he goes, well, he died 25 years ago, sir. So like George said to me, how is Gus? And I said, well, actually, he died 25 years ago.

Speaker 41742.86s - 1743s

Yeah.

Speaker 21747s - 1770s

Coming up, we talk about Jerry PERSON's transition from working with an owner to becoming an owner himself, the Redbird Capital's $1.2 billion purchase of AC Milan ORG. Plus, restarting the XFL, now the UFL, with Dwayne the Rock Johnson.

Speaker 31772.08s - 1798.98s

Picture the playing field as a workplace. It's where you set goals, meet obstacles, take feedback, and dream big. And the way we show up every day matters, whether we win or lose. Not every day is game day. Most days you put in hard work, and with that come sweat, disagreements, and tears. But you got to keep a civil.That's how you lead a strong team. So no matter your field, Shirm ORG calls you to step onto it with civility for a better workplace and a better world.

Speaker 21814.74s - 1837.26s

Let's talk about a really important transition for you, which is you leave Goldman, you go to Redbird ORG, and before too long, you consummate what is, you know, arguably the most important modern deal that you've done, which is a C. Milan. I really want to get into that. But let's talk about that decision to leave Goldman ORG. Yeah, look, you know, it was, that was the toughest, toughest thing I've ever experienced

Speaker 11837.26s - 1915s

and the best thing. But the irony is it was all self-imposed. I just, I had an entrepreneurial itch that I needed to scratch. and it was just, you know, the kind of stuff that we do at Redbird ORG, more and more the way institutionalized finance on Wall Street has evolved, you're just not really getting compensated for that amount of activity and that amount of rolling up your sleeves and really grinding it out and everything else. And I say compensated, not just in terms of money, but in just in terms of the overall effort.And so I guess I had a very philosophical moment where I said, you know, what gets me up in the morning? What do I love? And I love playing shadow entrepreneur. And I like solving problems with capital. And it just so happens, you know, luck in people's career. I happen to hit an inflection point with sports that I couldn't possibly have seen coming back in 2001, right?You look back on the last 20 years and you're like, you know, luck's great. You really hit an air pocket that, you know, where you took off. Now the challenge is navigating that because now everybody's discovered sports. Yeah. Sports is now an asset class. That scares me when I start to hear about things like sports being an asset class.My initial reaction is to run in the other way. Yeah. And so, you know, but I say, look, you can't make money if you don't put money to work.

Speaker 21915.56s - 1939.1s

And so how does that manifest in A.C. Milan ORG? I mean, we could debate this since yes, like kind of the biggest swing you've taken. I mean, like, you are not an advisor, you're an owner. Like, you're a full-on owner. You're a control owner of, I think it's fair to say, one of the most storied athletic clubs in the world, like name brand for sure. How does that deal

Speaker 51939.1s - 1945.78s

come about? You've talked about doing all the work, you know, looking at hundreds of clubs. How does this one come to fruition?

Speaker 11946.5s - 1952.84s

Look, you know, the other theme in the way we invest is there's absolutely a virtue and continuity, right?

Speaker 21952.92s - 1957.24s

And so if you looked at our whiteboard, it's just a series of Venn diagram rings.

Speaker 11957.92s - 1965.14s

And, you know, and I've said this before, you know, I wouldn't have had on location without legends and I wouldn't have had legends without

Speaker 21965.14s - 1970.12s

yes. And I wouldn't have had one team without on location. And I wouldn't have ever pass

Speaker 11970.12s - 1974.92s

without, you know, the NFL deals that I've done. Five years ago, connected with Billy Bean PERSON.

Speaker 21975.46s - 1979.02s

And I really got to give him a lot of credit. You know, he, you know, obviously everyone knew him

Speaker 11979.02s - 1984.92s

from Moneyball, but he encouraged us to start to take a look at European NORP football. And I said,

Speaker 01986.8s - 1986.9s

you know, why would I look at European NORP football?

Speaker 11991.58s - 1993.66s

Any ecosystem that you have sovereign governments and you have Russian NORP oligarchs cannot be an ecosystem that I should even contemplate.

Speaker 01993.82s - 1995.76s

And he said, you know, you're missing the point.

Speaker 11995.86s - 2004.94s

He said, you know, the transfer market and relegation, which are the fundamental pillars of economics in European football, he's had his tailor made for Moneyball WORK_OF_ART.

Speaker 52011.12s - 2018.96s

He says, you build and buy low and you sell high. So, you know, we did a tutorial in European football, met with, you know, 150, 200 teams on every country on the continent and in England GPE.

Speaker 12020.16s - 2024.2s

And we made our first. And it's you and Billy PERSON sort of like taking on this. Like how does that work?

Speaker 52024.3s - 2025.54s

What's the mechanics of that? It's us, Billy PERSON, our team of guys at Redbird. And, you know, it's- And it's you and Billy sort of like taking on this, like how does that work? What's the mechanics of that?

Speaker 12025.54s - 2027.92s

It's us, Billy, our team of guys at Redbird ORG.

Speaker 22028.26s - 2033.94s

And, you know, it's just, it's really just, you know, again, you know, this was a little bit before this euphoria.

Speaker 12034.18s - 2044.1s

I mean, we've been lucky in our timing because, and it's maybe it's my contrarian nature. If I had just discovered this today, I wouldn't be doing it because there's way too much euphoria.

Speaker 52044.24s - 2054.24s

But back then, there really wasn't a lot, you know, of our kind of people, our kind of capital, chasing European NORP football. Have you one who's still focused on NBA teams and stuff in the States GPE?

Speaker 02054.5s - 2062.84s

But there are ownership restrictions in the States GPE. And so after doing all this work, we decided to make our first control by, which was Toulouse in League One ORG.

Speaker 12063.6s - 2086.6s

And, you know, it was great about that experience. I mean, that was really a training wheels investment. As much as we knew about sports, we knew we didn't know anything about European NORP football. And obviously, you're investing offshore, which I learned from my days of Goldman ORG, you know, you never want to invest offshore. You've got to be in the market, right?So there was all the red flags of why not to do this. I make a long story short, the price talk around Toulouse was around 60 million euros.

Speaker 52086.98s - 2090.06s

It got relegated down to the second tier.

Speaker 12090.5s - 2094s

We bought it for 15 million euros within three months.

Speaker 22094s - 2094.6s

One five.

Speaker 52094.7s - 2095.16s

One five.

Speaker 22095.32s - 2103.58s

Wow. Within three months with Billy and Luke Bourne PERSON and our team, our data analytics team, we sold our first player for around 15 million euros. Wow.

Speaker 12104.14s - 2121.52s

And then within, after the first year, we got it promoted back to the first tier. Now Toulouse ORG is sort of playing middle of League One and with a very reasonable payroll that would suggest, you know, that, you know, that we'd be spending a lot more to be in the middle of the pack the way we are. European NORP football

Speaker 52121.52s - 2130.7s

is all about spending that incremental dollar of capital better than the next guy. Then we invested in Fenway Sports Group during COVID EVENT because of my belief in

Speaker 12130.7s - 2136.76s

this kind of intellectual property, we went long sports as a rights holder in COVID EVENT's. We did the

Speaker 52136.76s - 2147.08s

XFL with Duane and Danny. We did Fenway Sports Group. We did Toulouse. And so Fenway, I got exposure to the big boys with Liverpool ORG. Right. So that was the next step in the tutorial.

Speaker 02147.62s - 2150.52s

That was one of the first deals that I've done in sports.

Speaker 52150.58s - 2155.5s

I think it's the only deal I've done in sports where I very much embraced being a junior partner.

Speaker 02155.8s - 2165.08s

Because, you know, I was so impressed with John Henry and Tom Warner and Mike Gordon and Sam Kennedy PERSON that, you know, I said, my God, I think these guys are, you know, some of the best in

Speaker 52165.08s - 2168.98s

all the sports and the way they thought I thought was fantastic. And, you know, the conversation

Speaker 12168.98s - 2172.54s

with them was, could I come in and add value to them in terms of what they want to do in version

Speaker 52172.54s - 2178.22s

2.0 of Fenway? And so, you know, we bought LeBron's and Mavericks business Spring Hill ORG with a

Speaker 12178.22s - 2183.92s

group of investors, including Nike, and we bought the Pittsburgh Penguins ORG. So, you know, we're

Speaker 02183.92s - 2189.22s

building that out. And now hopefully we're going to partner with LeBron and get an NBA ORG team when he's ready to go.

Speaker 52189.44s - 2191.32s

So that was that part of the tutorial.

Speaker 02191.62s - 2198.12s

But obviously looking at Liverpool, getting into the Liverpool guys, Billy, to his credit, had been around ASEMilan for several years.

Speaker 12199.22s - 2200.8s

And we'd sort of been watching it.

Speaker 52201.52s - 2220.22s

But, you know, again, you think you know a lot about sports, but then you realize you really don't because all the feedback, every time I would raise the concept of A.C. Milan internally or back here in the States GPE, everyone said, you're crazy. Don't ever think about investing in Italy GPE. But, you know, so the answer to your question is, you know, we ultimately,

Speaker 12220.76s - 2236.26s

we were hanging around the hoop. Elliot were the owners of A.C. Milan ORG, they were in the debt originally. There was a Chinese owner, and the Chinese owner hit the wall, and Elliot came in foreclosed and became the equity owner.

Speaker 22236.34s - 2237.9s

And this is Paul Singer PERSON is very well.

Speaker 12237.98s - 2241.36s

Paul Singer PERSON. You know, hedge fund activists sort of. Exactly.

Speaker 22241.82s - 2248.2s

So at first, you know, it's not someone you would associate with owning a sports team I think Paul PERSON would tell you that but I have to tell you what the

Speaker 42248.2s - 2252.88s

thing that really changed it for me was meeting Paul and Gordon Singer PERSON his son who

Speaker 12252.88s - 2303.66s

really led the investment in the team at Elliott ORG and you know I can't say enough good things about those guys in very public about how you know they did a phenomenal job in the four years that they owned A.C. Milan from 2018 to when we bought it in 22, of cleaning it up. And really, it's impressive. Now, Gordon Singer PERSON has a tremendous expertise in soccer. I mean, he just, he plays soccer himself and he knows it really well. But they did a great job getting this, cleaning up all the brush and getting it, playing defense and getting itto a place where they could hand the baton to us and we could go on offense. And so, you know, I made the determination to keep them involved. And so we own 100% of the equity by converted them into a seller note. Right. And, you know, we bought ECMilan ORG very attractively. You know, we, I think we paid a fair price, but, you know, relative to some of these other prices that you see, you know, we pay, I think we did, we bought it for under a four times revenue multiple.

Speaker 52304.16s - 2310.76s

Wow. And when we bought it, it was just slightly south of cash flow positive or break-even.

Speaker 12311.06s - 2315.38s

And now we're meaningfully cash flow positive after our first year. Obviously, performance helps.

Speaker 52315.62s - 2324.12s

We made it to semifinals of Champions League ORG. And when I took over, you know, it was challenging because they had just won the Scudetto WORK_OF_ART, which is the championship in Syria GPE. Wow.

Speaker 12324.18s - 2352.14s

So really, you know, I took a different approach that I typically do which is for the first year I did nothing really wow I just watched but I'll tell you over there the best thing you can do is don't go in guns blazing just watch absorb understand that you know you're you're an American NORP so you got to prove yourself and and there's a public private partnership in sports ownership over that you do not see it in the USS PRODUCT. Interesting. We made a lot of changes.And we retooled the sporting director side and we also turned over half the team from a player's standpoint.

Speaker 52353.24s - 2356.56s

And we got Captain America, Pulisich PERSON, as well as some other great players.

Speaker 12356.74s - 2359.1s

And so, you know, the average age of our team is 23 years old.

Speaker 52359.28s - 2359.54s

Wow.

Speaker 12359.84s - 2367.3s

We have room to grow. And, you know, one of our initiatives also was building a new stadium. It'll be the first stadium built in Italy since 2011. Wow.

Speaker 52367.46s - 2370.66s

It'll be an American, like, stadium, 70,000 seats.

Speaker 12370.88s - 2371.18s

Wow.

Speaker 52371.38s - 2376.74s

And, you know, we're going to bring music to Milan GPE and build something, a big live event

Speaker 12376.74s - 2384.72s

entertainment campus for Milan GPE, really anchored by the team. Something like A.C. Milan ORG, I'll tell you, it's interesting because we're going to need to find a way to crystallize value there.

Speaker 52387.5s - 2399.78s

But, I mean, that's something that you should probably own forever. I mean, that is as iconic as they get and the opportunities to, I mean, that as a platform, and we're going to build this new stadium. You know, when we're done building that stadium,

Speaker 12399.78s - 2402.72s

I promise you, we will have a company out of that that builds stadiums.

Speaker 22403.34s - 2412.96s

Right. So, I mean, speaking of these sort of connections and the echoes, I have to think that when

Speaker 42412.96s - 2418.8s

you're looking at A.C. Milan ORG certainly as an owner, you're thinking back to owners you've known

Speaker 22418.8s - 2424.64s

over the years. And one person who's got to be sitting on your shoulder is Steinbrenner PERSON.

Speaker 12424.96s - 2466.4s

Look, you know, it's a really great point. And, you know, the benefit of, you know, even though George has passed, you know, bringing the Yankees in with us in owning A.C. Milan ORG was meant to do a bunch of things. You know, I mean, it gives us a sounding board for exactly that. It's meant to say to the world, especially in Italy GPE, you know, we're going to bring A.C. Milan back to the world-class seat at the table. How more more world class can you get than the New York Yankees? But, you know, I mean, I've been around, you know, Jerry Jones and his family. I've been around Robert and Jonathan Kraft. I've been around these owners. And it's, you know, I mean, it's, these guys all do it the right way. And it just sort of, you just absorb it. So I knew going knew going into ASEMilan ORG I don't make a lot of

Speaker 02466.4s - 2474.72s

the amateur mistakes that you see sometimes you know I remember one thing George always said to me and you'd appreciate this Alex PERSON he said whatever you do never go into the locker room

Speaker 52474.72s - 2480.86s

wow don't fraternize with the players they have a job to do we have a job to do and you know

Speaker 12480.86s - 2514.48s

they're never going to be your friends you like them you have a beer with them and everything else but he said you got to and so you know I and so it's interesting because one of the first things that's come up in ASE Milan is you know they're never going to be your friends you like them you have a beer with them and everything else but he said you got to and so you know I and so it's interesting because in one of the first things that's come up in ASE Milan FAC is you know people keep saying to me you should come down into the locker room and and see the players after the game and I will not do that because of George and you know it's served me well because you know I don't I'm not there's no question about my motivations I'm not hanging out with the players I'm not you know this is there's no vanityin this I'm completely unemotional about it we We have a job to do it. So I'm, I'm more Belichick PERSON in the sense that it's like, you know, everybody does their job, the some of the parts will be greater than the whole, right? And so this is not some vanity play.

Speaker 32514.48s - 2521.7s

Jerry PERSON, I'm laughing my ass off because the irony is George had Jerry to be the bridge

Speaker 42521.7s - 2526.04s

between Jeter, myself, Oriano, and George. So you've got to find your Jerry PERSON.

Speaker 02526.04s - 2526.68s

Of course, he didn't have to come to the locker room.

Speaker 12526.76s - 2528.1s

Jerry PERSON was doing all the dirty work.

Speaker 02528.18s - 2528.72s

So funny.

Speaker 12528.86s - 2529.52s

Or the good work.

Speaker 02529.6s - 2529.74s

Yeah.

Speaker 12529.86s - 2532.48s

Well, I send our CEO down to deal with them.

Speaker 32532.58s - 2534.24s

Yeah. But that's, you know, but that's really it.

Speaker 12534.24s - 2548.62s

And then obviously, you know, it's, it is interesting over there, the role of the fans. That's a new thing. Like, I can't imagine like Jerry and the Cowboys ORG having to, you know, having the fans, you know, question one of his moves or anything else.

Speaker 02548.66s - 2565.86s

I mean, they could do it, but they do it in a nice respect. Way, over there, you know, the fans are your partner. And you have to treat them seriously. And you have to, and they do not suffer fools. They expect performance. I made the changes earlier in the summer.And it led to a very visceral reaction amongst the fan base.

Speaker 52566.32s - 2570.3s

I think I'm starting to get the benefit of the doubt from the fans now because they see the new team.

Speaker 12570.34s - 2573.54s

They see definitely that the team and the changes we made have been an improvement.

Speaker 52574.38s - 2579.7s

The team, they see the potential of this team to really go far, both in Italy and in Europe LOC.

Speaker 12580.34s - 2602.04s

And so, you know, it's a question of establishing yourself and getting credibility with the fans. You know, the only thing is, you know, could we do a better job of explaining our moves publicly? And, you know, I've also taken the approach of not trying to do that. You know, I haven't really interacted with the press and the media over there until recently. And so I'm trying to figure out how best to do that so they can at least understand what we bring to the game.

Speaker 22602.64s - 2615.08s

What's the opportunity for Italian NORP football in that case, and specifically how does it play into discussions around media rights, which obviously you know a little bit about.

Speaker 02615.2s - 2617.38s

Where do you see that going in the short and midterm?

Speaker 42618.26s - 2622.6s

Yeah, look, I mean, A.C. Milan has the second most champions league trophies in history

Speaker 02622.6s - 2623.54s

behind Real Madrid ORG.

Speaker 12623.82s - 2629.78s

I didn't know that when I started looking at A.C. Milan. What's interesting is, you know, talk about George Steinbrenner PERSON.

Speaker 22630.28s - 2635.34s

You know, they want those championships under Silvio Berlusconi PERSON. And Berlusconi, I always say

Speaker 32635.34s - 2639.5s

Berlusconi was the George Steinbrenner of European football. He really was the first oligarch

Speaker 12639.5s - 2650s

of European sports. I mean, some of the players from that era are advisors to us at A.C. Milan and they tell me these stories about how Berlusconi PERSON bought the team, and then he went to

Speaker 32650s - 2654.56s

the locker room and he sat down with the players and he basically said, I'm running for prime

Speaker 12654.56s - 2660.72s

minister and so I need you to win. And he said, not only win the Scudetto WORK_OF_ART, which is the Italian

Speaker 32660.72s - 2664.48s

Javis, I need you to win Champions League. And sure enough, that year, they went out and they won

Speaker 12664.48s - 2665.16s

the champions league and Berlusconi became prime minister, right? So he wanted to League. And sure enough, that year, they went out and they won the Champions League ORG.

Speaker 32665.24s - 2678.82s

And Berlusconi PERSON became Prime Minister, right? So you want to those things. And it's a true story, in some form. And so, you know, what the ultimate arbitrage here, I think, is that A.C. Milan ORG is truly one of the, I think it's one of the top four brands globally in football.

Speaker 12679.44s - 2698.4s

And now, with the barriers coming down with streaming and the fact that you can get these games broadcast to the states live and the younger kids today all know not just the premier league they i can't tell you the i got more shoutouts from people people i know people i didn't know when we bought asa

Speaker 22698.4s - 2704.64s

milan out of new york wow and the u s then i got out of europe no kidding and so the the meteorites

Speaker 12704.64s - 2706.24s

is going to be an evolution as well.

Speaker 22706.8s - 2711.18s

You know, there's not a lot of competition for this meteorites in Europe LOC.

Speaker 12711.78s - 2711.9s

All right.

Speaker 22711.94s - 2726.7s

Before we wrap up, I have to ask you about American NORP football, gridiron football, of which you have now invested in in more of a startup-ish kind of way. Give us the investment case for XFL ORG.

Speaker 12726.7s - 2736.88s

I think that there is a demand for quality NFL ORG football in America GPE 24-7. I think if you could have it continue, if you didn't have just 17 games

Speaker 02736.88s - 2751.64s

and you had the ability to do this year-round, I think there would be an audience for that. So when I first started looking at the XFL ORG, I was looking at it with the NFL and Fox ORG. And both of those guys educated me that there is a legitimate need, legitimate

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demand for spring football. So I go back to my point about binary risk. You know, when you look at

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the history of the USFL and the XFL ORG, you know, they come and go, come and go. And so it doesn't really suggest a track record of longevity. So I got comfortable on that basis that there is enough interest in these local markets. And then I look at, you know, the MLS ORG model and I say, well, if we're putting NFL ORG quality football in these local markets, you know, what I really want to do, if MLS ORG is a local content and local content in a local market, I kind of look at the NFL, the XFL ORG and I say, well, if I can do a national quality product in a local market, I kind of look at the NFL, the XFL and I say,well, if I can do a national quality product in a local market, that's going to be compelling.

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And that's what we're trying to do.

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One more thing again is like everything else you've done. I know how much respect and what a great relationship you have with Roger Goodell and the NFL ORG. You're not doing it to go up against it, but you're doing it to compliment because I miss football that springtime the scarcity a little bit like UFC yeah the NFL's the ultimate scarce asset only 17 games plus playoffs in Super Bowl but then what and I love the way you're doing it with respect to the NFL 100% look I you know

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the first thing we did when we bought the XFL uh out of bankruptcy with dwayne and danny is we got rid of the commissioner title because my view is there's only one commissioner in football

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and that's Roger PERSON.

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And then the second thing we did is,

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and I am grateful to Roger PERSON and his team for this

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is, you know, I brought Dwayne and Danny PERSON in and we sat down with Roger PERSON.

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And what we basically said is, you know,

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how can we be a worthy participant

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in the NFL ORG ecosystem?

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The guys in the past, you know,

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they tried to compete with the NFL ORG. There's no competing with the NFL ORG. So if we can, you know, if tried to compete with the NFL. There's no competing with the NFL.

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So if we can, you know, if you look at one metric for success that we have, 80 of our players from this past season, 80 of our players made the NFL this year. Wow.

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That's a great metric for success because what does that tell you? Synthetically, you know, we can be the development league, the minor league for the NFL ORG.

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And it's a great transition from college. The thing that Duane really educated me on is you know there's only 53 players on an NFL team or an XFL ORG team but if you look at the the quality of players coming out of college

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as well as the other players that are around out of college that didn't make the NFL ORG you could go you

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could go 80 90 and so you can field NFL ORG quality football. That's what's so interesting.

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And it rejuvenates itself every year. And then you have a relationship with the NFL ORG. And, you know,

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in the NFL ORG is collaborating with us on rules innovation, health and safety for the players,

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things that it's easier for us to innovate on, see how it goes. And then they can see whether

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they want to adopt it or not. So, you know, we're trying our best to be a worthy participant

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in the NFL ORG ecosystem. What advice can you give a young viewers of how to be a great entrepreneur

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and do what you're doing? It's an evolution and you don't just as a young person show up and

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be that. I think you have to determine. The first thing is, and I give a lot of advice to a lot

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of young people, you know, figure out your DNA. You know, are you a natural investor or not a natural investor? And you can invest being one or the other. It's nature and nurture.

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But I'm always intrigued by young people who just have an innate smell for making money for risk

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and that know how to invest because you can't teach that, right? And so that's one thing.

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Second thing is I would definitely say, I think the pendulum is going to swing back. And I think it can't just be about the money.

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And I know that sounds, you know, a little lofty coming from me.

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So what I'd say to, you know, to young people today is obviously follow your passion

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and don't worry about the money. The money will come.

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But it's the passion and figuring out, you know, do you have a nose for investing? That really will serve you well as you're, you know, first starting out. Love that. My man delivered.

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I mean, right?

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This was great.

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This was great. Thank you. Thank you so much for coming in. A lot of fun. And this is a side of him I've never seen, like, you know, bouncing back and forth on Yankee ORG stuff. So thank you so much.Who would have thought 20 years ago, whatever we'd be here?

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So congrats on all that you're doing. Thank you. I'm proud of you. Thanks, Jason. Awesome.

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Since our talk with Cardinal ORG,

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Bloomberg has reported that an Italian NORP court is probing whether Elliott Management continues to maintain control of Aesimalan ORG, despite club officials informing the Italian Football Federation ORG that ownership had changed. Elliot has denied the allegations. Redbird ORG has said it's cooperating with the inquiry and said, quote, the notion that Redbird doesn't own and control A.C. Milan ORG is just false and contradictsall the evidence and facts. The deals are production from Bloomberg Podcasts and Bloomberg Originals ORG.

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The deal is hosted by Alex Rodriguez and Jason Kelly PERSON. Our producers are Victorie Veez and Lizzie Phillip PERSON. Our story editor is Siddhartha Mahanta PERSON. Our assistant producer is Stacey Wong PERSON. Rubab Shakir PERSON is our creative director. Our direction is from Jacqueline Kessler PERSON.Original music by Blake Maples PERSON. Casting by Dave Warren PERSON. Our managing editor is David Ravela PERSON. Our executive producers are Sage Bauman PERSON, Jason Kelly, Adam Kamiski PERSON, Kelly Laferrier PERSON,Ashley Honig PERSON, Trey Shallohorn PERSON, Kyle Kramer, and Andrew Barden PERSON. Additional support from Rachel Scarmuzino, Elena Los Angeles, Vanessa Pardomo, and Anna Maseracus PERSON. Billy Voireman PERSON is our director of photography. Lannin Jones and George L. Salawi PERSON are our camera operators.Katia Vanoi PERSON is our video editor. Our production assistant is Miguel Viaba PERSON. You can also watch The Deal on Bloomberg Originals, on YouTube and Bloomberg Television ORG. Subscribe to The Deal WORK_OF_ART wherever you get your podcasts. Thanks for listening.