April 28 — Sens. Mitch McConnell and Tim Kaine, plus Ruby Bridges

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Alliance is matter.

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Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell PERSON joins me for a wide-ranging interview

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as he prepares to step down as Republican leader later this year.

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This is my principal interest, pushing back against isolationism.

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His thoughts on Donald Trump's PERSON courtroom campaigns. Do you think that presidents should be immune from criminal prosecution for actions while they're in office?

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Obviously, I don't think that.

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And his own legacy. Do you ever regret your vote to acquit? Plus, escalating tensions. Free, free, free college, fight! Protests over the Israel GPE-Hamas war spread on college campuses across the country.

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Obulation is a crime. What impact will it all have on President Biden PERSON's re-election campaign?

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I'll talk to Democratic Senator Tim Kane of Virginia ORG and barrier breaker. Civil rights icon Ruby Bridges joins me for our Meet the Moment WORK_OF_ART conversation.

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I was thrust into the middle of a situation that no six-year-old should be put in.

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Joining me for insight and analysis are Jeff Bennett, co-anchor of PBS NewsHour ORG, Jonathan Martin of Politico, former White House press secretary Jen Saki, and Mark Short, former chief of staff to Vice President Mike Pence PERSON. Welcome to Sunday. It's Meet the Press ORG.

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From NBC News in Washington GPE, the longest running show in television history. This is Meet the Press with Kristen Welkett PERSON.

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Good Sunday morning, after a monumental week marked by the first ever criminal trial of a former president and history making arguments before the Supreme Court. While Donald Trump sat in a New York GPE courtroom on trial for 34 felony counts of falsifying business records before the Supreme Court. While Donald Trump sat in a New York courtroom on trial for 34 felony counts of falsifying business records, the Supreme Court heard arguments on Trump PERSON's claim of presidential immunity, which could reshape the future of presidential power. The justices appeared ready to reject Trump PERSON's sweeping claim that he's immune from any criminalprosecution on felony charges of conspiracy and obstruction for trying to subvert the 2020 election, but suggested they might give Trump PERSON a different kind of victory, a delay in the case, signaling they could send it back to lower courts. At issue, a version of this claim that Richard Nixon made in 1977.

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Well, when the president does it, that means that it is not illegal.

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In nearly three hours of oral arguments, the liberal justices raised a series of hypotheticals to emphasize the consequences of Mr. Trump PERSON's position that presidents are entitled to absolute immunity.

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If the president decides that his rival is a corrupt person and he orders the military or orders someone to assassinate him, is that within his official acts for which he can get immunity?

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It would depend on the hypothetical, but we can see that could well be an official act.

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If a president sells nuclear secrets to a foreign adversary, is that immune?

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How about if a president orders the military to stage a coup?

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I'm trying to understand what the disincentive is from turning the Oval Office FAC into, you know, the seat of criminal activity in this country.

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For their part, the conservative justices on the court seemed focused on the impact on future presidents.

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I'm not concerned about this case, but I am concerned about future uses of the criminal law to target political opponents based on accusations about their motives. I'm not discussing the particular facts of this case, but it applies to any fraud that interferes

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seriously with any government operation, right? I'm not focused on the here and now of this case. I'm very

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concerned about the future.

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One of the strongest cases against immunity was made in 2021 by Senate Republican leader Mitch McConnell after he voted to acquit Trump in his second impeachment trial.

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We have a criminal justice system in this country. We have civil litigation.

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And former presidents are not immune from being

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accountable by either one. I sat down with the Senate Republican NORP leader and discussed presidential

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immunity and a range of other topics, including the protests on college campuses nationwide, and the recent aid package that was just passed for Ukraine. McConnell PERSON helped secure the deal in the Senate ORG after a months-long delay and fierce opposition within his own party. I began by asking about his call this week with Ukrainian President Zelensky PERSON. What was your message to President Zelensky? And is this aid getting there too late to make a difference, Leader McConnell PERSON?And is this aid getting there too late to make a difference, Leader McConnell PERSON?

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I can only express my own view, which is that I'm with them. And I don't think we ought to try to force a settlement they don't want to make. I have the same view of Israel GPE, for example, the administration basically saying, you ought to have an election. It's not our job to tell them to Democratic NORP ally whether or not to have an election. It's not our job to tell them to democratic ally whether or not to have an election. Or also, and I think we've done some of thisin both these countries, trying to give them restrictions on how they fight the war. They're there, they're in the conflict. I don't think telling them how they ought to run their military operationis in our best interest or theirs.

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I want to get to the isolationism in your party, and I do want to get to the Middle East LOC. But just on this point, do you think after this six-month battle for aid to Ukraine GPE, do you worry it's getting there too late?

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I think we need to stick with them. I think it's important to us. Look at all the good things that have happened to us as a result of this. Most of the money is being spent in the U.S. in 38 different states. The Europeans NORP have stepped up. We've got two new members of NATO ORG.The Prime Minister of Japan here a couple of weeks ago spent a lot of time talking about Ukraine GPE. And he had previously said that if you want to send President Xi a message, beat Putin PERSON in Ukraine GPE. This is a worldwide problem. It's not going to go away after one supplemental.

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Well, let's talk about your concerns about the future, the isolationism in your own party. What is your message

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to the isolationist in the Republican Party? At Ronald Reagan PERSON had it right, you get peace through strength. And I would say to the Democrats NORP, they've got a problem on the left. So it's not just us having kind of an isolationist discussion. You've got visible anti-Semitism NORP on the left. So we've all got to get serious about the challenges ahead of us. Engaging in anti-Semitic behavior in the United States GPE needs to be stood up to by the administrators ofthese colleges? Well, we're going to talk about the colleges.

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Anti-Semitism, though, is not just a problem that's unique to one party or another. I mean, anti-Semitism is something that the country is facing together. But I do want to ask you, on this issue of the future of the Republican Party ORG, you're saying that it's turned the corner on isolationism. What gives you that confidence when more House Republicans NORP voted against more aid to Ukraine than for it?

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Well, I'm a minority leader of the Senate ORG, and I can only report how we've done here. We had predicted correctly that if there were votes in the Senate ORG, and I can only report how we've done here. We had predicted correctly that if there were votes in the House ORG, it would pass. And I'm proud of the fact that we got 10 more votes this week than we had two months ago. And I think our members are focusing on the facts. And the facts are that this is in our best interest. This is not some charitable contribution to Ukraine GPE.

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But 15 Senate Republicans NORP did vote against it. So to people who say, we're not turning a corner, this is where the party is headed.

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I think the party is heading in a different direction from them. From the isolationists.

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Yeah.

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Let's move on to the tensions in the Middle East LOC that have spilled over across this country.

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As you referenced, we have seen pro-Palestinian protests on college campuses all across the country. House Speaker Mike Johnson was at Columbia University this week. He said, quote, this is dangerous. This is not the First Amendment LAW. This is not free expression. Do you agree with him?Is that your assessment, too?

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I think it's a dangerous situation.

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You said pro-Palestinian. There's also anti-Semitism, which is completely unacceptable.

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I didn't, I've been shocked to see that in this country. First responsibility is the administrations of these colleges. That's the first responsibility. And so the speaker is correct in saying, laying the blame on the administrators. When I was in college, and I bet when you were in college, there were plenty of debates, but we were not trying to shut people up and had aggressive civil discussions.That's the responsibility of the college administrators. And to do anything else makes them look like they're sympathetic with one side or the other. And I think restoring order and civility to have reasonable debates is what needs to happen.

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To the students who are protesting peacefully, though, do they have a right to protest on college campuses?

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Oh, of course. Yeah. But I think people need to understand. Just the fact that we are the First Amendment LAW doesn't give you the right to scream fire in a theater and run everybody out. I mean, sure, you're free to speak, but you're not free to harm others with your speech.

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I want to talk to you about abortion, which, as you know, is one of the biggest issues for people all across this country right now. Back in 2022, you said a national ban was possible. So as I sit here today, I want to ask you, Leader McConnell PERSON, would you support a federal ban on abortion?

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I said it was possible. I didn't say that was my view. I just said it was possible. What is your view? Would you support a federal ban? Because? I said it was possible. I didn't say that was my view. I just said it was possible.

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What is your view? Would you support a federal ban? Because the Supreme Court has put this back into the legislative arena,

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and we're seeing it play out all across the country. And I think in the end it will reflect the views of these individual states. But I did not say, I said possible. I didn't say that was my view. I don't think we'll get 60 votes in the Senate ORG for any kind of national legislation. I think it's a practical matter. It's going to be sorted out at the state level.

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If a federal ban came before you for a vote, though, would you support it? A 15-week federal

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ban with exceptions? What Lindsey Graham PERSON is proposing? Yeah, I'm not advocating anything at this level. I think it's going to be sorted out all across the country and be very different in different states.

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So you don't think a federal ban is likely you think it's possible?

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I don't think any federal legislation is likely to get 60 votes in the Senate ORG on any direction.

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When I talk to advocates, they say they want clarity from the Republican Party ORG on this issue. Should the Republican Party ORG take a stance on whether it supports a federal ban?

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At the risk of being redundant, it seems to me views about this issue at the state level vary depending on where you are. And we get elected by states. And my members are smart enough to figure out how they want to deal with this very divisive issue based upon the people who actually send them here.

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Let's talk about what's going on at the Supreme Court this week. In 2021, you voted to acquit Donald Trump in his second impeachment, saying on the Senate ORG floor, quote, we have a criminal justice system in this country, we have civil litigation, and former presidents are not immune from being held accountable by either one.As we sit here, Donald Trump's PERSON attorneys are arguing before the Supreme Court that presidents are immune from criminal prosecution for actions that they take while they are in office. Do you agree with that argument?

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We're going to find out, aren't we? I mean, the Supreme Court is going to deal with that direct issue that I was referring to on February 13th of 2021. And I think we'll find out sometime soon.

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What do you think, Leader McConnell PERSON, do you think that presidents should be immune from criminal prosecution for actions while they're in office? Obviously, I don't think that, but it's not up to me to

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make that decision. The president clearly needs some kind of immunity, or be in court all the time. So we'll see how the Supreme Court deals with it.

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Just to be very clear, you said former presidents are not immune from being held accountable.

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You stand by those comments? That was my view, but I don't make that decision.

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But you stand by those comments? That's my view, but my view, it's only my view. I mean,

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the court is going to decide. Yes. But just to be clear, you stand by those comments. Former presidents

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are not immune from being held accountable. I do, but many times I have to say, I'm not on the Supreme Court.

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I don't get to make the final decision on that.

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Do you ever regret your vote to acquit former President Trump in his second impeachment trial?

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Look, he was not president anymore at that point. It's a big debate about whether or not you could even impeach somebody, remove them from office that they don't hold. I stick with what I said then. I addressed this issue on January 6th, and on February 13th, I stand by everything I said.

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So you do not regret your decision to acquit him?

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I stand by everything I said when I address this issue on January 6th on February 13th.

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And you have said that you endorse former President Trump PERSON. Are you going to vote for him?

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I said three years ago, shortly after the assault on the Capitol FAC, that I would support the nominee of the party, whoever that was, and I do.

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And that includes voting for him?

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I said it three years ago. I'm not just making news today. I'm simply referring back to what I said shortly after the assault on the Capitol FAC.

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And to those who hear that and wonder how you can support him, despite being so critical of him after January 6th.

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There's no question, none. That President Trump is practically and morally responsible for provoking the events of the day.

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Despite saying that we've got to leave this up to the courts, what say you?

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Well, the answer is the Republican NORP voters of this country have spoken. They get to pick nominees for president. So how I'm spending my time is on something I can have an impact on, which is making sure my successor is the majority leader and not the minority leader.

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I want to ask you about your legacy. You said just this week that you often feel like the only Reagan Republican NORP left. As you prepare to step down from your leadership position this year, what are your greatest concerns about the future of the Republican Party ORG?

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Well, I tell you, I feel better about it after we had our vote. I don't know when I said that. It may have been before the vote, but I do think peace through strength, which is the Reagan formula, which is the Eisenhower formula, and not the Robert Taft PERSON isolationism back in the 40s, is recovering. And I think in this episode, more of my membersreally focused on the facts. And it's hard to argue against the supplemental. It's in our interest. This is not charity to Ukraine GPE. It's in our interest. And I think we've sort of refocused on the importance of playing the kind of role that we need to play in the world.It's in our interest. None of this is charity. The whole democratic world is in favor of what we did this week. That should get the attention of our members. Plus, all the jobs that are being created in their states with the money that we're spending, retooling our industrial base for the big challenges ahead against China, against Russia, against Iran GPE.

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I hear your optimism, and yet some Republicans NORP say, this is the last aid bill that will ever get passed to Ukraine GPE. Can Ukraine count on the United States GPE to stay with it for more support, more aid in the future?

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Well, just to go back in history one more time, before World War II, Robert Taft PERSON was the most important Republican NORP. Everybody knew who he was, desperately wanted to be president. He opposed Len Lees, and most of the Republican NORP senators did. And then after the war, Pearl Harbor changed all that for a few years, but then after the war, he opposed NATO and the Marshall Plan. He ran for president in 52, fortunately, lost to Eisenhower PERSON,who had a totally different view of America GPE's role in the world and what we needed, the role we needed to play. So we've had a tendency to be isolations when there were Democrats in the White House FAC. But I think fact, if you look at the condition of the world right now, it's actually more dangerous than before World War II EVENT, more, because we have terrorism that they didn't have.

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And yet the leader of the Republican Party espouses an America-first foreign policy, which is the very definition of isolationism. What concerns you about that as you prepare to step down from your leadership position?

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Well, it's a family dispute. I won't go over the details, but you all have had that sort of thing recently as well. It's a family argument. And I'm pretty clearly on the non-isolationist side, and I tend to do my best to convince my members that that's the way to go. And even after I leave this job, I'm not leaving the Senate ORG. And this is my principal interest, pushing back against isolationism. This is going to be your focus once you step down

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from leadership. It is. Okay. Leader McConnell PERSON, thank you very much. I really appreciate your time.

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Thank you. When we come back, student protests over the war in Gaza GPE spread across the country.

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Will it impact President Biden PERSON's re-election campaign?

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Democratic Senator Tim Kaine of Virginia ORG joins me next.

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Colleges across the country are grappling with growing tensions over the war in Gaza GPE as protests spread. More than 200 protesters were arrested at campuses across the country Saturday. USC ORG has canceled its main commencement ceremony. Joining me now is Democratic Senator Tim Kaine of Virginia ORG, the author of a new book, Walk, Ride, Paddle, A Life Outside. Senator Kane PERSON, welcome back to meet the press.

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Kristen, great to be with you this morning. Well, it is great to have you, Senator. Let's dive right

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in and talk about these protests, which we've seen on college campuses all across the country. They are not monolithic. There are pro-Palestinian protests. Some of the protests are calling for a ceasefire. We've also seen anti-Semitism on some of these college campuses. My question for you this morning, do you think the Biden PERSON administration, the president,has a role to play in this moment in addressing what we are seeing in these college campuses? Kristen PERSON, it's a really good question.

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And, you know, this is a tough one because people have a right to protest and make their views known. And almost, you know, overwhelming percentages of people do that peacefully. But there are those who intimidate or harass others. There are those who speak in hate speech or anti-Semitism. And so giving people the latitude to do what they ought to be able to do and also trying to curb on acceptable behavior is tough.Here's a role that I think the president can play. We know of places where maybe these discussions are not being done the way they should be. They're not being done civilly. But there's also some universities that I think are doing this right. And one of the things that I think it might be important for the president or maybe the education secretary, Secretary Cardona PERSON to do, is hold up some examples of colleges in the country. And I think there are a number of them where discussions about difficult topics like Israel and Gaza GPE are happening, but happening in a way that really can be a model, where people can express their points of view on tough issues, but not feelintimidated or harassed because of the positions they hold. So I think the president can use the bully pulpit to kind of hold up some good examples, and I would hope that he and other members of the administration might do that.

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Well, let me ask you about how far you think this should potentially go. As you know, Speaker Mike Johnson visited Columbia University this past week. And he said, quote, if this is not contained quickly and if these threats and intimidation are not stopped, he said that the National Guard should be called in. Is that something you would support if the situation escalates on college campuses? Kristen, I think calling in the National Guard ORG to college campuses

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for so many people would recall what happened when that was done during the Vietnam War EVENT, and it didn't end well. The National Guard going to college campuses, Kent State ORG and elsewhere, did not end well. And I think that would be a very, very bad idea. I think there are other ways using campus security, but also, again, offering students more opportunities to have dialogue that is civil and constructive where people hear one another. That's by far preferable.So no, I do not think the National Guard ORG is a solution to this.

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I want to ask you about the policy now of what is happening in the Middle East LOC. You voted this week for a foreign aid bill that will send more aid to Israel GPE. It includes about $9 billion in aid for military weaponry. I want to play you something that your colleague, Senator Bernie Sanders PERSON, had to say. Get your reaction on the other side.

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Netanyahu and its extremist government are clearly in violation of U.S. GPE and international law,

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and because of that, should no longer receive U.S. GPE military aid.

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Is he right? Senator, what's your reaction?

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So two things. Senator Sanders voted against the aid package, which was Ukraine GPE aid, Israel defense aid, but also Gaza humanitarian aid. I voted for the package because we need to defend Ukraine. And look, I think the U.S. needs to help Israel defend itself. You saw, I think it was two Saturdays ago, hundreds of missiles and drones fired by Iran to attack Israel on its soil. And the U.S. GPE and other nations helped Israel GPE defend itself so that that did not cause damage in Israel, which would only have led to an escalation. So I believe we do need to help Israel GPE defend itself from those who would annihilate it,Iran, Hamas, Hezbollah, others. But we also need to lean on Israel GPE, and we have been doing it increasingly publicly, to allow more humanitarian aid to Gaza GPE, and that was in the package we voted for on Tuesday, to do what they can to reduce, and that was in the package we voted for on Tuesday, to do what they can to reduce civilian suffering. The most important thing, Kristen PERSON, right now that we all need to reach is we need to reach a ceasefire and hostage release. Release the hostages, get into an extended ceasefire that will then de-escalate violence in the region.It will enable us to get more humanitarian aid to Gazans. And it will open up this discussion that is long delayed about a future for Palestine GPE, a future that was promised in 1948, but that's never been realized. Senator, I want to ask you about

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your book, Walk, Ride, Paddle. I have it right here. You say in one section of the book,

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2016, when you were then Secretary Clinton PERSON's running mate,

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taught me some painful lessons about a country I thought I understood. What are the lessons? How do they apply to this election, particularly when President Biden is losing support among young voters over this very issue we're discussing, the War in the Middle East EVENT?

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A couple of things that I learned along the way, Chris PERSON, and I embarked on this Virginia Nature triathlon when I turned 60 and celebrated 25 years in public life. 2016, one of the things I learned pretty powerfully is there's still a double standard affecting women. Look, I knew that intellectually. I'm married to a professional woman, and I've seen it in her lives and in the lives of others,but not until I was on that trail with Hillary PERSON and saw a good person and a good public servant, you know, judged more harshly than her opponent in numerous instances. I think I really got a Ph.D. in the continuing existence of a double standard for women. But I also learned on my journey something really important. We are polarized in this country in politics, Joe Biden or Donald Trump or Israel or Gaza GPE. There's a lot we disagree on,but we need to remember, without sugar-coding that, there's also a lot of areas where we agree. In nature, you find unity. You find Democrats NORP, Republicans NORP, and independents who all have their favorite place to go to watch a sunset or stream to fish in. And as Americans NORP, we can't sugarcoat the issues that divide us, but we also need to remember there's a lot of things that we have in common. And I found that on my Virginia Nature ORG triathlon.

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Well, it is a pretty profound message. It is a good read. Senator Tim Kane, thank you so much for joining us for your insights this morning. We really appreciate it. You bet.

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Thanks, Kristen PERSON.

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And when we come back, as Donald Trump's criminal trial played out in New York this week, his lawyers argued to the Supreme Court that a president might be immune from prosecution, even if they try to overthrow the government. Stay with us. The panel's next. Welcome back. The panel is here. Jeff Bennett co-anchor of PBS News Hour ORG. Jonathan Martin, Politics Bureau Chief and Senior senior political columnist for Politico ORG,former White House press secretary, Jen Saki, host of Inside with Jen Saki, and Mark Short PERSON, former chief of staff to Vice President Pence PERSON. Thank you all for being here getting up early.

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The morning after the White House correspondence dinner, really appreciate it. Jonathan PERSON, let me start with you and my exchange with Leader McConnell PERSON, which I asked him if he stands by his argument that no one is immune. He ultimately said, yes, he stands by it. It comesas we had this extraordinary day of arguments in the Supreme Court. What do you make of all of it?

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I thought it was a superb interview. Thank you. And I think McConnell PERSON has torn between politics and history. He is trying to find a way ahead in a party that's led by somebody who he has nothing but contempt for. McConnell thought Trump was discredited after January 6th. I know he thought that because he told me so that night.And that has proven to be wrong. And McConnell PERSON is now stuck in the shadows of his career with a nominee and maybe a president who he finds contemptible and who he has profound disagreements with on policy issues like national security. And he makes that point to you that in the end of his career, he's going to fight this fight on national security because that's what he is trying. His legacy is trying to keep that Reagan flame aloft and fighting Trump PERSON as the best he can. And frankly, the only way he can with just national security.

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Yeah, it's just fascinating that he says he's going to dedicate his time to that. Mark PERSON, let me turn to you. You were obviously there with former Vice President Mike Pence on January 6th of the Capitol FAC. You've testified before the grand jury. But I'm curious for your take because it seems as though, based on what we heard at the Supreme Court, it is very likelythis case is going to get kicked back to a lower court. That could mean a delay. That likely means that this case won't go to trial before Election Day. What are the implications of that?

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Well, Christian PERSON, I think that most voters have made their decisions at this point. And I think that the president's actions on January 6th, he should be held accountable to the voters. I'm not sure that we should be looking for the legal system to render a verdict there beforehand. I think the reality is that from the court's perspective, this is a novel case. I think it's understandable the process,but I think the American NORP people should hold him accountable. And I also think, candidly, that I think Mitch McConnell's been entirely consistent on this. I do think, despite the president's, I think, dereliction of duty on January 6th and

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many of the advisors around him, at the end of the day, you don't want to be impeaching former presidents when you have a whole weight of the government prosecuting, you don't have a White House ORG counsel's office to defend you. I think that'd be a terrible precedent.

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Can I just add on the McConnell PERSON interview, which I thought was also very well done? I mean, he said

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a lot of things that a lot of people in Congress ORG would probably agree with on a range of positions.

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However, he struck me as quite passive for a person who is not passive.

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He's not a wallflower.

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He's the Senate ORG Minority Leader. He's jammed through Supreme Court ORG justices. This guy is not shy. And what it told me is that he is struggling, as Jonathan PERSON referenced, with this, I want to be speaking out against isolationists. I want to talk about who we are as a country, but I don't want to touch Trump PERSON. And the problem is Trump PERSON's views, he's the leader of the party.He is an isolationist. It's intrinsically tied to your success in that effort.

Speaker 31999.82s - 2005.24s

Jeff PERSON, what about that argument, which I tried to make at the end of the interview, you're saying

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you're turning the corner on fighting against isolationists, the leader of your party right now. Is espousing an isolationist view?

Speaker 92013.92s - 2018.08s

And that was especially pronounced on the matter of January 6th, where we saw the majority

Speaker 32018.08s - 2049.1s

leader at the time say that Donald Trump was practically and morally responsible for January 6th, but yet he voted to acquit, not once, but twice, when he had the opportunity in those impeachment trials. And so it's a huge issue. Certainly he's trying to preserve his role within the party and make sure that, as he said, that Republicans NORP emerge victorious in the election.Well, President Biden made a little bit of news on the state of play this week when he was asked if he would debate former President Trump PERSON. Here's what he had to say. Take a look.

Speaker 142049.98s - 2060.58s

I don't know if you're going to debate your opponent. I am somewhere. I don't know when. I'm happy to debate him. I've invited Biden to debate. He can do it any time he wants, including tonight.

Speaker 102061.24s - 2067.84s

Jonathan Martin. I'm curious for what Jen Saki's reaction would have been like if she's still in the

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White House when she heard President by blurt out during a live interview that he was

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going to debate.

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Because Biden PERSON's folks don't want him to debate.

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They don't want to give Trump that platform and risk exposing Biden PERSON like that on national

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TV.

Speaker 82079.04s - 2083.6s

Except I was thinking if I was in my old job from two years ago, you also don't want

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him to say no because no is weak and no is fear.

Speaker 102087.46s - 2088.44s

So you have to say yes.

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They both have to say yes. Now, whether this happens, we all know there's lots of things that need to be negotiated.

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It won't happen tonight. It won't happen tonight. Kristen PERSON's not ready for it.

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If Biden PERSON does debate, I think it'll be a tell for us this summer that Biden's got ground to make up still. If he does agree to it, that's a

Speaker 32105.02s - 2120.96s

reveal that he's got to come back still. One of the issues that they will undoubtedly both have to deal with if they debate Jeff Bennett is what is happening in the Middle East LOC. We are seeing how fraught that issue is. It's playing out on college campuses all across the country with these

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protesters. As we've said, they are not monolithic in their messaging, but this is something that they have to grapple with. And we've seen President Biden PERSON try to

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calibrate his message, on the one hand, condemning anti-Semitism on college campuses. On the other hand, defending students' rights to protest. I talk with Biden PERSON allies who say that, yes, these protests are significant. It's unclear right now what the impact will be, in large part because the students who are actively engaged in these demonstrations, as the Biden PERSON campaign sees, that they are a subset of a subset of the electorate. And if he has any challenges with younger voters, it likely won't be on this issue of the humanitarian catastrophe in Gaza GPE, it'll likely be on economic issues and the

Speaker 02159.06s - 2165.12s

high cost of living and so on and so forth. But it really speaks to the ways in which President Biden PERSON has a challenge,

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really, in trying to keep together this broad, disparate coalition of voters. It's a precarious coalition

Speaker 02171.44s - 2175.9s

from AOC to the Cheney PERSON family. They don't have a lot in common, and it's hard to keep them all

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on the same page. And young voters, Jonathan PERSON, who he needs to turn out in force. Well, that's

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the real challenge. And you go to a place like Michigan or Wisconsin GPE and just take the college

Speaker 32184.72s - 2189.38s

towns there, Ann Arbor, you know, Madison GPE. If you can't keep those folks away from

Speaker 102189.38s - 2198s

either a third party candidate or staying home altogether, there goes Michigan and Wisconsin GPE, and there goes to presidency. It's not more complicated than that. Yeah, Jen PERSON, you know, a lot of people

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have noted President Biden PERSON hasn't come out and sort of made formal remarks about this yet. Does he need to? And to my point that I put to Senator Kane PERSON, do you anticipate he's going to announce some executive action or policy on this?

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Well, he did announce he's going to go speak at Morehouse University in a couple of weeks.

Speaker 32213.82s - 2214.4s

And that is...

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That is a significant decision. There will undoubtedly be protesters there. That in itself is a statement. I want to go in and be in the belly

Speaker 02222.9s - 2263.06s

of where people are feeling this passion on a campus. I do think, just to echo what Jeff PERSON said, it's important when you're sitting in the White House FAC and you're sitting on a campaign, you're very mindful of what you're seeing among young people on college campus. What you're also mindful of is things like the Harvard IOP people where the economy and housing costs. That is the number one issue for young people in these polls. And you have to be mindful of that as well, as well as people experiencing anti-Semitism across the country. Now, I do find it a little ironic when you have people like Mitch McConnell who's like not talking about how Trump PERSON is echoingHitler, talking about anti-Semitism of the Democratic Party ORG. But that aside, it is an issue. So you have to factor in all those things politically and also factor in how you're going to win the war.

Speaker 132263.34s - 2291.24s

I think that leaders of our higher education institutions are so collectively cowards today. I think the University of Florida ORG has been a unique exception, which they've allowed both free speech and protection of students. And I find it fascinating to see how many LGBT people are aligning with the Palestinian protests when, in under a rule of Hamas ORG or most of the Muslim countries, they would be sentenced to death and killed. And yet in Israel GPE, they would have the same rights of every other citizen.Yet they're aligning with the Palestinian NORP protesters on most of these campuses.

Speaker 32293.34s - 2300.26s

We have about 30 seconds left, but quickly. I mean, Speaker Johnson says the National Guard ORG should potentially be called in. Senator Tim Kaine PERSON said that would be a huge mistake.

Speaker 132300.94s - 2302.58s

I agree with that. But I think, I mean, let's stop and also reflect.

Speaker 222304.8s - 2325.12s

There are eight Americans still being held hostage, Kristen. Why are we? Why are who are these protesters out there protesting against people who are actually? Many of them are protesting of 30,000 people who died in Gaza. But it is, it is not a one singular cited issue. And there was a ceasefire before a Moss PERSON attack. It is a hugely complicated issue. We will continue to discuss and debate it. Thank you for a wonderful conversation.

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When we come back, President Biden shows his sense of humor at the White House Correspondence Dinner. We'll have the highlights next.

Speaker 32335.64s - 2345.72s

Welcome back. President Biden PERSON took on his age and his campaign rival at the White House Correspondence dinner last night.

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The 2024 elections in full swing. And yes, age is an issue. I'm a grown man running against a six-year-old. But look, age is the only thing we have in common. My vice president actually endorses me.

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Biden PERSON, who has held fewer news conferences than his predecessors, also roasted the journalists in the room.

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Some of you complain that I don't take enough of your questions. No comment.

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While attendees celebrated the First Amendment LAW at the dinner inside, pro-Palestinian demonstrators outside the Washington Hilton protested the president's handling of the war in Gaza GPE. Our friend and colleague, Kelly O'Donnell, who is the president of the White House Correspondents Association ORG, and a senior White House ORG correspondent, used her remarks to bring attention to journalists who've been captured or killed for doing their jobs. Evan Gershkovich, Austin Tice PERSON, and reporters who have been killed in Gaza GPE. She also highlighted the need to preserve press access.

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My gratitude is multiplying because this week marks a career anniversary for me. 30 years with NBC News ORG. We believe that independent professional journalists on hand to document the events of a presidency are stewards of something precious, more enduring than any news cycle or trending topic. We preserve the historical record, part of the legacy of the First Amendment LAW.

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In her 30 years at NBC News, which she marks this week, Kelly has covered four presidential administrations, seven election cycles, and has been a frequent panelist on Meet the Press ORG. So congratulations to Kelly PERSON and the entire White House Correspondents Association for another great evening highlighting the importance of journalism in a free press and for awarding scholarships to the next generation of journalists.When we come back, the six-year-old who became a tiny but mighty symbol of bravery in the fight to desegregate schools. Our Meet the Moment conversation with Ruby Bridges PERSON is next. Welcome back. At just six years old, Ruby Bridges PERSON became a civil rights icon simply for attending her school, which was newly desegregated in 1960. Bridges PERSON and her mother had to be escorted by federal marshals under theloud jeers of segregationists who protested her pursuit of a basic education. Over the past 25 years, Bridges PERSON has been visiting schools all around the country and replying to the letters of students who've sought her advice. Some of that correspondence is now in a new book, Dear Ruby PERSON, Here Are Hearts. I recently sat down with Ruby Bridges PERSON for a meet-the-moment conversation. She describes the painful experience she had as a little girl at one point using a racial slur, words she heard at the time as she speaks in deeplypersonal terms. Thank you for being here. It's a real honor to be able to talk to you. I want to start off by talking about this beautiful book that you have written in which you answer the letters that children have written to you. What do you hope people will take from your book? You know, it took me back to

Speaker 232562.94s - 2608.2s

being six years old and thinking about what I was going through. And I think we as adults, we underestimate the minds of our little ones because I know that I was having these really grown-up adult thoughts. I mean, I was thrust into the middle of a situation that no six-year-old should be put in. And I was really thinking about all those things. And so when I started to read some of these letters, I thought, wow, things really haven't changed all that much. We are still underestimating our kids.They are still concerned about grown-up issues, and I heard their hearts.

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Take me back to what that was like for you. When you were six years old, you were being escorted by U.S. GPE Marshals into a school that was newly desegregated. You had to sit in a classroom all by yourself. What was that walk to school like for you?

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You know, my parents never explained to me what I was about to venture into. The only thing

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they said is, Ruby PERSON, you're going to go to a new school a day and you better behave.

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And living in New Orleans and being accustomed to Mighty Grau EVENT. I mean, you know, we see that

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during Mighty Grau EVENT. Huge crowds, screaming and yelling. So I often say what protected me was the

Speaker 232648.88s - 2673.18s

innocence of a child. I thought that day I was venturing it to a Mighty Girl Parade EVENT. So I wasn't afraid. It took a while before I really found out that the crowds were out there for me. a while before I really found out that the crowds were out there for me. And that happened when I finally had an opportunity to meet another child. Tell me about that. Well, kids were

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being hidden from me. There were some white parents who tried to send their kids to school with

Speaker 232678.74s - 2728.84s

me, but they were never protected by federal marshals like I was. So they had to cross that picket line and they were being attacked. So even if they were not races, it would probably be very hard for them to send their child. But they did, a few of them. And the principal was part of the opposition, so she would take them and hide them. So they would never see me and I wouldn't see them. them and hide them. So they would never see me and I wouldn't see them. But once I got into the classroom and met these other kids, a little boy said, I can't play with you. My mom said not to because you're a nigger. And the minute he said that, everything sort of came into focus for me,that it wasn't mighty grower, that the crowd out there was out there because of me and the color of my skin.

Speaker 32728.84s - 2740.88s

After you realized what these crowds were saying to you, how did you feel going to school every day walking past them? What was that like for you?

Speaker 232740.88s - 2791.64s

I would not really focus on them. I would block them out. And mainly because I loved school. I never missed a day. And that was because of my teacher. Had an amazing teacher who came from Boston to teach me. She was white. Barbara Henry PERSON. Barbara Henry. I mean, there were days when if you opened the window because we didn't have air conditioning, you could hear them screaming and shouting and chanting. And she would go to the window and close the window and say, oh, today we're going to have music.You know, it was little things that she did that made me love school. I knew that if I just got past the crowd, that it was a short walk and into the building, I was going to have a great day.

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What goes through your mind when you hear these debates unfold all in schools across the country about what should be taught, what should be read, what shouldn't be access to books. What do you think about?

Speaker 232808.28s - 2840.22s

Well, I think that's ridiculous. I mean, most of my books have been banned. And the excuse that I've heard them give is that my story actually makes, especially white kids, feel bad about themselves. But I believe that it's just an excuse not to share the truth to cover up history. But I believe that history is sacred, that none of us should have the right to change or alter history in any way.

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Are you afraid that not just your history, but the history of civil rights is being threatened in this country?

Speaker 232850.12s - 2861.66s

Yes. Those things are what we live with today. The history, all the subject matter that they want to ban, it's happening in the world.

Speaker 32862.7s - 2867.1s

We cannot live in a bubble, put blinders on like it's not happening.

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And if we think that we are actually fooling our kids by banning books,

Speaker 32873.34s - 2876.06s

oh my God, where are we really?

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Because kids have computers, they have so much information at their fingertips.

Speaker 32881.8s - 2885.54s

I have to go to my grandbaby to say, tell me what's happened,

Speaker 232885.62s - 2893.82s

open my phone, do this, whatever, all of us. So we're not hiding anything from our young people.

Speaker 32895.02s - 2902.92s

If you could talk to the six-year-old Ruby Bridges, what would you say to her on that first day of

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school? I would just say, Ruby PERSON. It's okay. Don't worry. It's all going to be fine. It's going to work out.

Speaker 32916.02s - 2916.22s

Ruby Bridges PERSON, thank you so much.

Speaker 232916.76s - 2919.14s

Thank you.

Speaker 32921.08s - 2950.16s

Really powerful conversation there. That is all for today. Thank you so much for watching. We'll be back next week, because if it's Sunday, it's meet the press. When it comes to buying, when it comes to buying your first home, everyone has questions. When it comes to buying your first home, everyone has questions.

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