Hour 2: Curry's Cooked

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All right, more NBA ORG action to get into with limited playing time. Just 29 minutes before Steve Kerr pulled Steph Curry PERSON. Curry scored 31 points, made five three-pointers, but the Warriors couldn't contain the T-Wills ORG perimeter shooting. Lost 114, 110 at the Target Center FAC.That loss drops the Warriors ORG. Two games behind the Los Angeles Lakers for the number nine spot in the Western Conference. Steph only played 30 minutes in this one. Kirk PERSON gave his reasons after. Take listen.

Speaker 1053.3s - 72.7s

We've put the burden of this franchise on his shoulders for 15 years. We can't expect him to play 35 minutes. We have five games in seven days on this road trip. So if you want to say that him playing 30 minutes instead of 32 is a difference in the win and the loss, I totally disagree with that.

Speaker 1173.36s - 93.66s

Every game matters. You know, we're inching closer to the other end of the standings that we never thought we'd be in. So nobody's going to wave the white flag and say, you know, you're mailing it in. And that means playing more minutes and I'll be ready to do that. Hmm.

Speaker 1494s - 94.3s

All right.

Speaker 1194.34s - 98.5s

And where are you on this one? Do you agree with Kurt on limiting Steph PERSON's minutes?

Speaker 799.04s - 156.4s

Hell no. Because as you said, yeah, you put it on his shoulders for the last 15 years. But that's the expectation that we have for great players. What great players that we didn't expect to play, especially given the situation. I can see if you're the number one seed and you've got two or three games, two or three game lead, you want to live in his minutes.But you're fighting for your play-in life, not your play-off life, your play-in life. And the Houston Rockets are only one game back. They've won eight straight, and you're simply finding ways to lose these games. So I disagree with Steve Kerr PERSON. And it seems to me that Steph Curry PERSON wants to play because he doesn't want to be a guy that misses the play and misses the playoffs.I understand that last year they got bounced in the first after they played the Lakers and they ended up losing. But I disagree with Steve Kerr PERSON on this one because that's the expectations that we have for great players is that they play more. They do more and we expect more from them.

Speaker 6157.8s - 178.4s

He's doing a lot. He's doing a lot. Let me ask you a question. Let me ask you a question, Shand PERSON. Can you drive a vehicle with rims with no tires? No.No. Can you, can you? Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on.Can you drive a vehicle with ties with no rims? No.

Speaker 7179.24s - 179.56s

No.

Speaker 6180.44s - 253.46s

You're asking, this is what Steve Kurt PERSON is saying. We're asking Steph Curry PERSON to be the rim and the tie. Sometimes the help need help. Damn it, he's doing his part. Steve Kerr is saying can Clay Thompson, can CP3, can Draymore, can Jonathan Kaminka PERSON, can y'all elevate y'all game?Like, we look at all the greats. Every guy that didn't won the championship whether was joy join was the rim damnic pippin was the tie uh lebron james was the rim anthony davis was the tie when we look at all the grates every great there was a rim they had a tie they had somebody that was going to help them now i will say this what it sounds like like to me is Steve Kerr PERSON is not denial where they at right now and he knows that his team is not that damn good. So basically why should, why shouldI run my guy, Steph Curry PERSON, into the ground in the position that we're in knowing that we're not going to make no noise anyway? He knows what the championship team look like. Damn it, he's been a part of four of them. So unlike you and these Lakers ORG fans, he's actually seeing the big picture.

Speaker 7254.94s - 284.26s

We just don't have enough. Hold on, wait a minute. When they beat the Lakers ORG, every time they win a game, Steve Kerr PERSON comes out there, this team can make a deep playoff run, as we have to get healthy.Every time they lose, now all of a sudden, the burden of the franchise has been on Steph Curry PERSON. You can't have it both ways, Perk PERSON. You can't say we can make a deep playoff run when you win, but all of a sudden you lose, and all of a sudden, Steph Curry's playing 30 minutes.You don't get to have it both ways. It's Shannon PERSON.

Speaker 6284.58s - 339.76s

Would you agree that if you were in Steve Kerr PERSON position, and look, I give Steve Kerr a lot of heat, but wouldn't you agree that this year for him has been exhausting, having to deal with Draymond Green PERSON and everything that's been going on with him, his suspensions, you know, him being away from the team, dealing with Clay Thompson PERSON, not being the best version of Clay PERSON, having to put him, move him to the bench and have him come off the bench,having to trust into a young fellow like Jonathan Camingo PERSON, who could come off as being a bit selfish at times with his shot selection, but you don't want to pull a card from him because you want to keep his confidence high. Having to watch your guy, Steph Curry PERSON, go out there night to night as one of the smallest guys on the floor,take this physical beating because bigger defenders are on him every single night, and you're watching your team, and it got to be exhausting. It's exhausting.

Speaker 7340.4s - 378.26s

But that's how Steph Curry PERSON became Steph Curry. So what? Steve Kerr thought he was going to have it like 2016, 17, 18, 19, 21. Is that what, 22, is that what he thought? That it was going to be all peaches and cream for the entirety of his coaching career. He has the best win percentage in the history of the game.So how was it supposed to turn out for him, Perk PERSON? He don't want any adversity. He doesn't want any hardship. He wants it great all the time. I thought there has to be some adversity. I thought there was supposed to be some rough waters here and there.Damn, Perk PERSON, you want it great all the time. You want it 75 and sunny.

Speaker 6379.44s - 454.58s

Do you think it was sunny outside when he had to step in and have a conversation with Clay Thompson PERSON that he was going to move him to the bench? That wasn't a sunny type conversation. Perk PERSON! That's called coaching. Damn, you can't. But, look, Shannon PERSON, Shannon, you know this, okay?Clay Thompson is a future Hall of Fame ORG. Okay? You know this as being a franchise guy. It is not easy to have those conversations with a guy thatthen helped you build the dynasty. A guy that then created this dynasty with you and Clay Thompson PERSON. Now, going to my next point, this is what I'm trying to tell you. See, you're indenial right now. When it comes out to the tell you. See, you're in denial right now. When it comes down to the Los Angeles Lakers ORG, you are in denial. We talk about the Warriors ORG. Hold on. Hold on, but let me get to my point. We're sitting up here and we're watching the Lakersand they have shown us who they are. That's why they're in a nice spot. Steve Curtis PERSON sitting up here saying, we are in the 10 spot. I'm looking at this team. I'm looking at this tough Western NORP conference. I'm looking at this uphill battle that we have to climb.And damn, I'm not about to sit up here and run Steph Curry PERSON into the ground.

Speaker 7454.94s - 501.5s

That is a smart move by a coach and that has faced reality. To answer your question, that's not what he said last week when they beat the Lakers ORG. He said they can make a Jee ORG playoff run. So was he lying then or is he lying now? To your second, to your first, to your original point. How many kids you got, Perk PERSON?I got four. You got four kids. At some point in time, you've had to sit down and have a conversation with him, right? That's called parenting, because everything is not going to be going to the amusement park, getting cotton candy and eating candy apples. Am I correct?That's called parenting. Coaching is not always about winning championships. Sometimes you have to have very difficult conversations with players that have been great for an extended period of time. And they're not where they are. They're not where they once were. That's called coaching.

Speaker 6501.94s - 504.1s

So he doesn't get to say, go ahead.

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And guess what else comes with coaching and parenting?

Speaker 6508.68s - 524.82s

Honesty. And that's what we're seeing out of Steve Curry. That's why I bought up the rim and the tie. Because Steve Curry is saying, basically, I need help. Steph Curry PERSON needs help. He does.Anybody that's been watching the Golden State Warriors could tell that damn it Steph Curry PERSON needs help.

Speaker 7525.36s - 538.34s

He needs help. Unless you're the Boston Celtics and the Denver Nuggets, every other team in the NBA ORG needs help. This is not mutually exclusive to the Golden State Warriors ORG. Come on with it.

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Shannon PERSON.

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Shannon PERSON, Shannon, listen, it's a lot of other teams right there that are knocking at the door.

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The Milwaukee ORG Bucks are knocking at the door. The Milwaukee books are knocking at the door. The Phoenix Suns are starting to find they stride. They're knocking at the door. So it's not just night and day that the Celtics and the nuggets are just that much better than everyone else. They are. The pelicans are knocking at the door.They're not.

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So my thing again, I'm the first person to say that, Perk PERSON. Perk, you're the first person to say that on the show.

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I feel like everybody has said that they're head and shoulders above everyone else. Stephen A. doesn't feel that way because he likes the Celtics ORG as well, but everybody else feels like they're men amongst boys. No, and then especially when you look at the Eastern Conference ORG, look at what the Milwaukee Bucks have been doing of late, Miley PERSON.Look at what they've been doing. Look how they win the Boston ORG and they competed, but look at the teams that they've been beating since the All-Star break. You get this Milwaukee Bucks team, that series against the Celtics is going seven games.

Speaker 7600.3s - 609.38s

But I'm saying people are not saying that the Celtics ORG need anything. You keep saying that the Golden State ORG needs something. Every team needs something.

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All right, we've got to go.

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We've got to go.

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We'll be continued.

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My wish for the future women in sports is just to keep breaking the ceiling, to realize that you literally can do anything. I think now young girls coming up, they don't see any obstacles in front of them. And as we get older, as more generations come along, I want them to see themselves in spaces, front offices, fields, courts, wherever. I want them to know that there's no space that is off limits to them because they really can do anything. Kimberly PERSON, thank you.

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Adi Crooks scored 40 points in Iowa State's come from behind win over Maryland ORG, but then got a taste of her own medicine. Kiki Erie often went off, 41 41 for Stanford ORG who knocked off the cyclones. Quick take for you, Shannon PERSON. Shannon PERSON, what's the best performance you've seenon the women's side so far?

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Kiki-Eery-Offin, 41.16 rebounds. And when Cameron Brink PERSON filed out, she made sure that Stanford ORG was able to get the win. She scored 11 of those 41 in overtime. She was sensational down the stretch with the absence of the All-American Cameron Brink PERSON.Kiki-Eri-Otie-Ot often had the best that I saw opening weekend, that 41.16 rebound game.

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Coming up tonight on ESPN, the NCAA Women's Basketball Championship's second round continues with Syracuse ORG, squaring off against Paige Becker's and Yukon, followed by West Virginia GPE, taken on Caitlin Clark in Iowa GPE. Then freshman Phenom, Juju Watkins leads USC against Kansas ORG. All games also available on the ESPNF ORG. Fourth-seated Kansas bounced by Gonzaga, 89-68 on Saturday.Kansas ORG looked gas throughout the game as they struggled with depth, shooting, consistency, and injuries. In the second half, Gonzaga went on a 15-0 run while Kansas missed 10 straight shots after the game. Kansas ORG head coach had this to say. Take a listen.

Speaker 12827.6s - 858.28s

Well, I think for the last month I've been thinking about next season, to be honest, not in the moments during the game, but, you know, obviously we played, we had eight guys on scholarship and we play, I mean, that were healthy there late and, you know, injuries are part of the game. So that's not, that's not an excuse. When you don't have as much firepower or, you know, that maybe you've had in past years, it certainly showed this year.

Speaker 14860.12s - 864.64s

Hmm. All right. Shannon, do you have any issues with Bill Self's Commons?

Speaker 7865.38s - 925.16s

Yeah, yeah. Excuses are losers ethos. For you to say that, I mean, I'm just trying to figure out. So I've been thinking about the, I've been thinking about next year for about a month. Now, had a player said that, we would ream a player. If a player ever came out and said after the game, I've been waiting for this season to get over for the longest. I've been thinking about next year for the last two or three months. We would kill him, but somehow, like Bill Self PERSON thought that he said this and like we were going to be okay with it. I don't hear one care. I don't care about anything about no eight scholarships. I don't care about we've been running on fumes. I don't care about that.You cannot, you cannot say this because it sounds like you haven't been invested the last month of the season because you said you're thinking about something in the future. I'm dealing with right now. You ask your players to stay in the moment. Coaches, you've got to stay in the momentbecause you're asking your players to do something that you're not willing to do. Now, I got a huge, a huge problem

Speaker 8925.16s - 1013.4s

with what Bill Self said. Shannon PERSON, I agree with that. I think he misspoke. I'm not sure that is exactly what he was saying. Because look, as a coach, he's coaching his team. He shouldn't have said that in that moment in time. But while he's going through the season, he's also evaluating his season. He's evaluating his roster. He's evaluating his roster construction. He's evaluating the mistakes he made so evaluating his roster construction. He's evaluating the mistakes he made so that when the season is over, he can move forward with a better plan interms of roster management. But when he said it and what he said was wrong, the idea that he can't multitask and while the season is going on, he's talking to his staff about recruiting, roster construction, getting deeper, how are we going to deal with the portal? What players do we need to kind of get where we need to go to build a bench? They had, they had, they were like 350th in benchments this year. All right, his bench play was absolutely non-existent.What he said was wrong. In the environment and the stage, he said it on it was wrong. In terms of, can you balance that and multitask? Yeah, you can. As a coach, you can't just stay in a moment. You've got to have agility.You've got to be thinking forward thinking. You can't wait until the season to end. But it didn't impact the way he prepared for the game. But I agree with you 100%. He misspoke, poor time, tore place, poor stage. Shouldn't have been said.And I would hope he would actually talk it back. But Bill Self PERSON is Teflon. A lot of stuff just kind of slides off him. He gets away with some stuff.

Speaker 71014s - 1023.44s

Jay, before you go, let me fall over to Coach Self PERSON. So now, so can a player, okay, I'm playing this many minutes. Let me start thinking. Should I go into the portal? Should I prepare them to start?

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They are thinking that. They are thinking that. Of a dude ain't playing. I prepare them to like... They are thinking that, Shannon PERSON. They are thinking that.

Speaker 71027.2s - 1059.04s

But do they're playing? Let me tell you, that dude is thinking about, hey, his people already in contact with AU ORG coaches and potential suitors. And quite honestly, the coaches out there, I got three calls this morning from guys that have playersthat are pretty good players that in their first meeting, after getting knocked out of the tournament, they already told the coach, said, you know what? I've got all these schools calling my mom and talking to me about different opportunities.That's happening 12 months a year, seven days a week, unfortunately. Okay.

Speaker 91059.86s - 1134.26s

Shannon PERSON, you know what's really interesting about this? Because we're all in alignment on, he should not have said that. One of the challenges that I think we're starting to see in real time, Bill Self is 61 years old. He's been coaching 20 plus years, obviously incredible resume, won two national championships, just one one a couple of years ago. But I think what we're seeing is the pressure that's starting to amount with college coaches becoming CEOs and managers of players. I think it's all of it. I think before they always used to managea lot of different things, Seth PERSON, but I think now with raising capital, now with becoming a GM, now we're dealing with individual players and their agents. As I hear a lot of kids say, it's about M&M. When they come into schools, it's about money and minutes, which I, look, it's a new age, right? It should be about that to a degree. But I think it's becoming harder and harder for coaches to understand how to deal with people. So I think you are having coaches who are older in this game who aren't coming up with how it's being done.Thinking to themselves, man, like, this is hard this year. I've had horrible roster reconstruction. I need to do things differently. Man, what is next year going to be like? So it's wrong, but I'm starting to understand how older coaches are dealing with the new challenges.

Speaker 81134.26s - 1147.92s

I don't think it's just older coaches, Jay. Well, I think it's all coaches. I think the business of college basketball, the business of college athletics has changed. And you've got to make a decision. Old young, I think age has nothing to do with it. Old young, you've got to make a decision. Old Jung PERSON, I think age has nothing to do with it. Old Jung PERSON, you've got to make a decision, all right?No, no.

Speaker 91148.06s - 1168.22s

The transfer point out and I think age has something to do with it. I think Nick Saban PERSON said some of that do with it. We're seeing a lot of older coaches retire earlier now because they don't want to have to deal with that. I think that for life or Seth PERSON guys who have been in this coaching for a long time. That takes a really hard turnovers. And I think Bill PERSON's really good at it. But don't, let's not act like it's not harder.

Speaker 81168.44s - 1216.44s

No, it is harder, but it's harder for young guys as well. But the older guys have already established themselves, and they can walk, and they can still take care of their family. A younger guy's got to deal with it because he's in a certain stage of his life where he's got to figure it out and make sure it works. Look, everyone's got to make a choice.Like Shannon, you have to make choices every day. What you can embrace and what you're not going to embrace. Look, it used to be coach, recruit, schedule, be the face of the university in the public, raise money for the institution. Now you know what we've added, we've added the NIL ORG and collectives. That's a big part of it.That's a part of your job. If you don't embrace that, you're not going to survive. And if you want to stay in the profession, that's a big part of it. That's a part of your job. If you don't embrace that, you're not going to survive. And if you want to stay in the profession, that's what you have to do. And then the other thing, and J. Will I 100% agree with it. You can't be grudge having to pay these players. You can't be grudge.

Speaker 71216.48s - 1224.6s

That's just part of the business. The greatest key to survival is adaptability. You either adapt or die.

Speaker 01224.6s - 1255.24s

And it's a lot easier to change your ways when you're younger. Bill Self PERSON, Nick Saban, a lot of these coaches have been doing it one particular way for 20, 30 years.And now there's a new way of doing business. We hear this all the time, Seth PERSON. I'm sure your wife has told you. Seth PERSON, you're stuck in your ways. It's hard to get out of those ways, Seth, when you're your age, as opposed to when you're 20, 25. You can change mainstream.But once you've been doing something for 30, 40 years, it's a lot harder. Trust me.

Speaker 91256.2s - 1293.4s

Agility. All I want to say is one last thing, because you said it to it at the beginning of this whole thing. We've had Rick Petino PERSON come out and calls team on athletic. We've now had Bill Self PERSON talk about I went somewhere else. I've been thinking about next year a monthago. There is going to be a time and space coming very soon where players are having their own platform where players are going to start calling out coaches too. It's going to be a very uncomfortable situation. I know the power dynamic is nevergoing to be conducive for them to do so, but that platform is coming now. It's coming. I call you out all the time, Jay. Well, I'm done with it. Ain't nothing new for us, huh, Seth PERSON?

Speaker 141293.7s - 1295.9s

And then five minutes later, it's all good.

Speaker 91296.24s - 1296.36s

Yeah.

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Always.

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We know what that is.

Speaker 141298.48s - 1301.2s

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Speaker 141365.9s - 1379.74s

Let's get it. After tagging quarterback Janarius Sneed to a non-exclusive deal, the Chiefs ORG are sending Snee to the Tennessee Titans for a 2025 third round pick and swap of a 2024-seventh-round picks. Shannon, what does this trade mean for the Chiefs ORG?

Speaker 71380.5s - 1410.94s

Well, I love the Chiefs did right by LaJuery Sneed PERSON. They knew they couldn't pay it and he was going to be unhappy on the franchise tag. So what? You ask him to come back next year. He has an even better year and now you're going to be able to pay it. You still have Patrick Mahomes, you have his Travis, you have Travis Kelsey PERSON and Chris Joneshas been in the fall. I like that they did this, did right by it. But LaJerry and Sneed, he has Super Bowl EVENT rings, not go secure your family. Now does it make it a little bit more difficult? Sure. But if anybody can overcome it, it's the Kansas City Chief of Long as they have Patrick Mahomes PERSON, they'll be fine.

Speaker 141411.36s - 1435.52s

Yeah, absolutely, trying to go for that three feet. All right, this just in, our Adam Schaefter reports that it was a unanimous ban that the hip drop tackles against the NFLPA ORG's objections. RG3 PERSON, do you agree with this ban? I'm not able to hear RG3 PERSON. Producers, I don't know if folks at home are. Shannon PERSON, can you hear him?

Speaker 21435.9s - 1436.66s

I cannot. I'm back.

Speaker 141436.86s - 1444.76s

Okay. I'm back now. Okay. My bad. I didn't unhit the mute button. That's all good. So the hip drop tackle obviously banned.Do you agree with it, RG3 PERSON?

Speaker 21450.06s - 1509.96s

Molly, I don't agree with it. I understand what the NFL ORG is trying to do by making the game safer, but what they're really doing is making it unsafe for defenders. When you think of this, like, how is the guy supposed to tackle an offensive guy from behind now? You got defenders that linebackers, DB, safeties that are going to be going up against guys that are 30, 40, 50 pounds heavier than they are. And the only way for them to get them down to the ground is to try to use their own body weight as leverage to get them there. I want the game to be safer. I have a guy that was hip drop, mollywap, and spun on my top in my NFL ORG career.So I understand how they're trying to take unnecessary injuries and unnecessary plays out of the game. But at the same time, I still want the guys to be able to go out there and play the game of football. And right now, this is only going to add more penalties to the game. It's only going to add more flags and more fines. And I don't think that's what people want to see. We want the game to be safe.But it's got to be an even playing field for both sides of the ball.

Speaker 71511.06s - 1600.1s

It's called Evolution PRODUCT, RJ3. I understand that, you know, this makes it a lot more difficult for defenders to get the guy on the ground. But you've got to think about, think about the first 50, 60 years. I really never saw this tackle. When I played, I can't recall someone getting in. I think I think maybe once I saw this tackle. But I played, I can't recall someone getting in. I think II think maybe once I saw this tackle. But now we see it with regularity, just like the horse collar. We saw that and then they outlawed that. Now, the problem that I do have with the NFL guys is that say, we're trying to make the game safer, but all the while you're at a 17th game and now you hear you're looking at an 18th game. So I don't give me this. This is about the safety of the game. But this is an inherently dangerous play. And I read, who was it?Someone said it has a 20 to 25% higher injury rate than any other play, any other tackle in the league. Well, when you start getting two times, three times, but when you talk about 20, 25 times, where you have to do something with it, I knew it was just going to be a matter of time. I thought they would do it last year because if you remember,I think Jacksonville did a hip-drop tackle on Patrick Mahomes PERSON in the playoffs. And it had him hobbled throughout the entirety of the playoffs. And so, but I knew this was coming. Just like that hit to the quarterback's knee in the pocket with Tom Brady PERSON, you knew it was just going to be a matter of time. So I totally agree. I understand.But guess what, guys? They want scoring to go back up. It's about to go back up now because it's going to make it a lot more difficult for guys to tackle. I'm with RG3 PERSON.

Speaker 171600.28s - 1683.86s

I don't get what we're doing here. This is football. And like him, I'm a five-step wide receiver. Trust me. I can put a highlight tape that rivals anybody in NFL ORG history on the wrong side of big-time hits. But the reality is you were putting the defense at an increased disadvantage in the game of football because if they run by you, you might as well stop trying.Because now you're starting to think about how you need to get them down. And to RG3 PERSON's point, it does create indecision. And that indecision is inherently more dangerous if everybody else is operating at a full speed juncture. Shedin PERSON, the reason why you probably didn't see this in your day is because they were clotheslining people.They were hitting them for real. And it wasn't going to be on top of those highlights. They was doing the real tackles, right? But this is just a fundamental tackle. You have to use your body weight to get people down. My question becomes, what's next?Is it now you can't tackle at the knees? Now you can't tackle it all from behind. Now you can't cut block. And yes, these are things that create injury. We have to, at some point, come to grips with the NFL being a 100% injury rate for players. You're going to get hurt.Anything head-related, anything that will affect your life mentally going forward, we understand. But we as all players understand there is an opportunity to go out there and there is a chance you will be injured. Last season, lower extremity injuries were at a four-year low. So my question is, who asked for this? Let me ask you a question.

Speaker 71683.98s - 1746.68s

It was at a four-year low. But when we look at the injury rate, what caused the majority of the injuries, even though it was at a low? I guarantee you, look at the hip-drop tackle. The number one cause of the injury, a lower extremity injury, was the hip-drop tackle. And it was Troy Vincent PERSON that said this. He said, the greatest asset for our athlete is durability and availability.When you have a play that's 20 to 25 times the injury rate, it doesn't allow you to fulfill your dreams. So this is Troy Vincent PERSON, who's the EV of the NFL ORG. He's saying the injury rate of this play is so great. We have to remove it. You're right. There used to be a time you could close line a guy. Even before my time, the head slap was legal, but they are doing a way with a lot of these plays to try to make the game safer. But you can't say we're going to make the game safer so we can add more games to the play on the back end.So we're going to make it safer on the front end, but we're going to add games to the schedule on the back end. That's where I push back on the NFL ORG. But I'm glad they removed this play because I knew it was just going to be a matter of time.

Speaker 21747.64s - 1829.48s

Shesh, you brought up Troy Vincent PERSON there, and I got a lot of respect for Troy Vincent and what he's been able to do. And he talks about being the gatekeeper of the NFL ORG. And as these plays continue to get removed from the game, I think what Hawk PERSON is getting at is the fact that we're not seeing these plays getting focused on for the defense. Yes, scoring is at a, you know, it's been down for the past four season. So they want that to come back up. But they shouldn't put it on the defenders to make thathappen right now as a quarterback, right? I love the protections for the QBs. You can't hit them high. You can't hit them low. You basically can't hit anybody across the middle until they catch the football, blink twice, get both feet down, make a football move, and then tell you, hey, yeah, you can come hit me now. Right. The fan at home is arguably saying to themselves, it's only a matter of time before NFL ORG football becomes physical flag football.Because as we continue to go through this, they're going to ban the hip, they ban the hip, hip drop tackle. They already ban the horse collar. What's going to be the next one?What's going to be the next thing that they take out of the game that is talking about making the game unsafe? Football is an unsafe game in itself. We have to make sure we keep the parameters of the game the same as we take some ofthese plays out. And I don't know if we're doing enough to protect defenders right now.

Speaker 71830.28s - 1833.62s

No, you're not. But here's it. Go ahead. I'll let you go. Go ahead.

Speaker 171834.54s - 1876.84s

I was going to say, I mean, I'm all for health and safety. Trust me, I am agreeing with everything Troy Vincent PERSON is talking about. But you are making it almost impossible for these defenders to do their job the way that the job description says so. So until you change the job description, you can't be changing their abilities to go about it at a successful rate, you know, without their input. And on top of that, yes, I get the statistics that you gave for the hip drop tackle.But if you ask any current players, what do you think the biggest impetus around these lower extremity injuries are? They're going to say the fact that you're playing on turf and grass on any given week. But every time they mention that conversation, it turns into RG3 at the beginning of this segment. It feels like they hear them on mute.

Speaker 71877.88s - 1935.78s

Yeah, because the thing is that means we're going to have to see, this right here, this rule change doesn't cost us any money. If we go to grass, do you know how much we're going to have to receive. This right here, this rule change doesn't cost us any money. If we go to grass, do you know how much we're going to have to pull up out? Do you know how much that's going to cost the team? Look, the NFL ORG is not in the business of writing checks. They like receiving checks. You notice the CBSes, the Foxes, the ESPNs, all these networks, the Amazon, the Netflix ORG,they cut checks. Very seldom does the NFL ORG pay anybody. They receive NFL a lot like the IRS ORG. The IRS ORG don't send that money. They receive money. Incoming, ain't nothing outgoing.So if we have to pull up all this artificial turf, this field turf, and replace it with grass, do you know how much money that's going to cost? Even though they're making money hand over over fist, still, I ain't trying to give up anything. So this play right here, Hawk PERSON, it doesn't cost us anything to implement this rule. To implementthe other rule what you and RG3 PERSON is talking about is going to cost us millions.

Speaker 21937.02s - 1988.04s

Shea PERSON, I love the analogy that you give, right? So I got one for you. The NFL wants scoring to go back up. I'm a girl dad of four. I take my daughters out to the tennis courts all the time,and I practice tennis with them, even when they're not with their coach. Sometimes I find myself like hitting the ball right to them so it can be perfect so they can hit that forehand and hit that backhand to the best of their ability. Well, if you're the NFL ORG,you can't just hand-serve points to the offense. You've got to let them go out there and play the game on equal footing and fair ground. I have to let my daughters go play matches, and I can't be in control of that. It's going to be what they end up doing. So I feel like right now, the NFL ORG unintentionally, or maybe intentionally, is handicapping the defense so much that the game isn't going to look the same to the fan at home.And that's the last thing anybody wants.

Speaker 71988.36s - 2007.4s

The fans always say, well, you're changing all these rules, but the moment they get a 10-7 game, man, this game suck. I want to see the game. What about the game that was 38 to 35? I want to see that game. But the moment they get a game, RG3, where the quarterback doesn't throw for 400, the wireless even doesn't have 200. Oh, man, this game sucks.

Speaker 142008.52s - 2015.4s

Yeah. I love that. You have your girls playing tennis, Robert PERSON. That was my favorite sport growing up, playing that with my dad, a lot of fun. Play the rest of your life.

Speaker 12016.26s - 2025.66s

Reggie White, who's a defensive end for the Green Bay Packers, says that the fire bombing of his church in Knoxville, Tennessee this week, was the work of racists who may have been trying to hurt him.

Speaker 32025.76s - 2033.16s

First, there was one fire, then there was another, then there was another. It wasn't just Reggie PERSON's church that burnt down. Hundreds of churches burned in the 90s.

Speaker 132033.24s - 2037.26s

I think we have a major problem in our country that we don't want to admit, and that has to do with racism.

Speaker 32037.5s - 2048.1s

Was this 1996 or 1956? 30 for 30 podcast, and Antsgate presents Through the Flames WORK_OF_ART. Listen now wherever you get your podcasts. Baseball is back.

Speaker 42049.8s - 2051.58s

And you know what that means.

Speaker 32053.68s - 2056.26s

ESPN Fantasy Baseball ORG is back too.

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Opening days around the corner, meaning it's time for you to draft your team.

Speaker 32062.5s - 2066.06s

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Speaker 42066.46s - 2069.98s

and you can play all season long on the ESPN ORG Fantasy app.

Speaker 32071.06s - 2074.78s

Sign up now at ESPN.com slash fantasy baseball.

Speaker 42079.66s - 2083.12s

Dionne Sanders and the Colorado is gearing up for year two.

Speaker 142083.26s - 2097.12s

After a hot start to last season, the Buffalo's finished four and eight, losing six straight to end the year. Deon's been vocal about his son Chador PERSON, dual threat Travis Hunter, entering the draft in 2025, and how much control they'll have over where they may go.

Speaker 152097.68s - 2105.54s

Where do you predict Chidor and Travis PERSON going in the draft? Top four

Speaker 52105.54s - 2122.5s

That's pretty beautiful Anywhere from one through four One arm is going to be one The latter one would not go Behind four Now all this is subjectiveBecause I know where I want them to go So it's certain cities that Ain't Ain't going to happen It's okay

Speaker 62122.5s - 2125.22s

You know a point It's gonna be a I'm sorry It's gonna be an Eli PERSON.

Speaker 142127.34s - 2134.56s

As you can see, Dion PERSON's got a new bookout, elevate and dominate. All right, Robert, you're up first. Do you like these comments by Dion PERSON?

Speaker 22135.72s - 2231.7s

Molly PERSON, I absolutely love him. And you heard Dion PERSON say it's subjective because of the cities. I also think it's subjective based off of how Shadur Sanders and Travis Hunter PERSON play. He has no doubt in his mind, and I don't blame him that these two guys are going to go out and have a successful year this upcoming season. But I'm seeing the power shift happen right before our very eyes, and I absolutely love it. And I want people to buckle up because what you see in college football is these coaches running to the NFL ORG because they hate the power dynamic that's going on in college football right now with NIL and player empowerment?Well, that's coming to the NFL ORG. And not every single player is going to be able to pull off something like that every single year. But if Shadur Sanders and Travis Hunter PERSON go out there and play the way that they're capable of, it certainly can. And I think that people have to realize that players now know they can control their own narratives, they can be in the media while they're playing, and they don't have to go with the status quo. Haleb Williams PERSON goes to the combine, doesn't do anything, doesn't let the doctors touch him, only does meetings.Marvin Harrison, Jr., doesn't even go to the combine, doesn't do a pro day, doesn't run a 40. These guys are taking control of where they want to go, and some of them, a select few, can tell NFL ORG teams, I don't want to play there, and they'll be right. It doesn't mean that they're not accepting the privilege that it is to play in the NFL, but Shannon, you know this in Hawk PERSON as well. That privilege is earned, and players are now seeing that they have more power than they probably had in the past and I'm all for it. My advice would be not to follow a blueprint

Speaker 172231.7s - 2290.78s

that you don't have the tools for. We are talking about Dion Sanders PERSON. So my message to anybody that's hearing this is the same message that I give the other Division I ORG coaches in recruiting. You ain't Dion PERSON. The same message that I give the players that want to go into coaching, you ain't Dion PERSON. The same message that I give the players that want to go into coaching. You ain't Dion. The same message that I would give to dads with sons who are top picks. You ain't Dion PERSON.And the same message to players whose daddies want to take the same approach, your daddy ain't Dion PERSON. Dion Sanders PERSON is a one-of-one. So yes, he probably has this kind of leverage because he had 40 years of being the man as a player, as a coach, a media member, a mentor, you name it in NFL ORG circles. Everybody else, you got to earn this kind of leverage. Even in the NBA ORG, when you watch players bounce around from team to team,they don't get there until they've earned that right. And then in football, if you're going to undo a whole draft system that everybody else subscribes to and all the top players still go through, you better have the leverage to do so. Otherwise, it's probably not going to go for you the way that you think it is.

Speaker 72291.54s - 2399.32s

Yeah, I'm not surprised that Time PERSON said this. I kind of know him a little better than probably you guys, so I'm really not surprised that he said this. Do I like it? No, I didn't like it when Eli PERSON did it, and I don't like it now. And like you said, RG3, it is a privilege to play in the NFL ORG. And I was just like, let whatever is going tohappen, let it happen. And I get what he's saying is like, look, everybody, every coaching system, every quarterback's coach officer coordinator is not equipped because I want to set myself, my son up for the most success possible. I want to put Travis Hunter PERSON in the best position possible. I promised his mom or I promised who his caretaker was that I was going to look out for this young man. And I'm going to fulfill my obligation not only while he's at Jackson State, not only when he's at CU Boulder, but going into the NFL ORG. And then I'm going to watch him until the end of time because that's what I promised you I would do.I'm going to treat him just like my son. He live with me. He's my son now and wish you do her. But for me, man, I just like, I understand there's a guys, both of you guys are right. There's a new power dynamic. And we're seeing players.We're seeing handlers, in this case, that's his son, take more ownership. Yeah. Placing, we're not going to do this. Like you said, if somebody would have told me, we're going toget to a point that a player is not going to even go to the combine and not have a pro day and it not negatively negatively impact him, I would have never believed it, I would have never believed it, RG3 PERSON. I'll have made you out your damn mind.Ain't no way. You're not going to go to the combat? Okay, you don't go to the combine. Well, we've seen guys not do things at the combine, but have a pro day and show out. He's like, I ain't doing none of that. Watch the tape.

Speaker 142399.82s - 2404.1s

But, Shannon, real quick, to Hawke's point, even when you look at Eli Manning PERSON, right,

Speaker 72404.14s - 2406.9s

when he came out, obviously, Archie Manning's PERSON son.

Speaker 02407.5s - 2409.18s

And he's Peyton Manning's, Eli PERSON.

Speaker 72409.52s - 2411.18s

Yeah, Peyton Manning PERSON's his big brother.

Speaker 02411.28s - 2412.58s

So it's a different deal.

Speaker 72412.98s - 2413.28s

It is.

Speaker 02413.28s - 2415.34s

Same to Hawks Point with Dion Sanders PERSON.

Speaker 72415.5s - 2450.18s

So you really think players like a Caleb Williams PERSON, they can pull this off? Oh, Caleb Williams. I mean, absolutely. Absolutely. You have a lot more leverage when you're the number one pick than say you're the 17th pick or you're the 21st. Hell, once you start getting past probably out of the top five, you're just happy to go anywhere.But when you're the number one pick, you weld a lot of power. Now, everybody doesn't use the power. Some people are just like, hey, my lifelong dream was to play in the NFL, and I got an opportunity to be the number one overall draft pick. I'll go anywhere. Send me to Antarctica LOC, the moon.

Speaker 02450.5s - 2472.94s

Hell, as a matter of fact, I'll play three years in hell if I'm going to be the number one overall pick. But Prime is saying, no, it's not so much how high I go is where I go that determines the success level. People think it's, well, he went number one. He did. He went number two. But if you don't go to the right situation, there's a greater chance you're not going to have the success that you thought you would.

Speaker 142472.94s - 2484.1s

Robert PERSON, for layman's terms, if a quarterback's going to flex and do this or any position, the topic, how does that happen? You just say, I'm not going to go to X, Y, and Z team. I refuse and then that team won't take them.

Speaker 22485.02s - 2584.16s

Well, Mala, we saw it happen with John Elway and also Eli Manning PERSON. The teams drafted them and then they traded them away. But to Shannon PERSON's point, really when it comes down to is the guys that have the leverage that can pull it off. And I'll put it this way. Shea, one of the guys that you're really close friends with and big supporter of is on the Mount Rushmoreof player empowerment is LeBron James PERSON. Yes. I can promise you right now today, LeBron James PERSON, if he was coming out of the draft, would have exercised his player empowerment and said he is not going to Cleveland GPE. Why? Because of the market, because of the history of the franchise, he still went out there and hedid everything that everyone expected of him and even exceeded it. His career has been unbelievable. But if he could go back and do it again and come out now, I'm more than sure he would exercise his power. This is why I said that Caleb Williams should tell the bears that he's not coming. It's not because they don't have the weapons.They do. They got Kenan Allen, DJ Moore PERSON, Cole Comet, they brought in D'Andre Swift PERSON. On the defensive side, they've improved everything. But what they don't have is organizational stability at the head coach position. So players are going to see these different things as they come out.And if they have the opportunity to exercise that power, they certainly will do it. The status quo, Shet, Shay PERSON, doesn't want that. They want it to stay the The status quo, Sheh-She doesn't want that. They wanted to stay the same. But to your point, we didn't think that a guy would skip the combine.We didn't think a guy wouldn't do anything in the pre-draft process and not be hurt by it. And right now, that's exactly where we are. People need to buckle upand get ready because this is going to become way more frequent. Hawk?

Speaker 172584.58s - 2587s

I fundamentally disagree on the LeBron James PERSON point.

Speaker 142587.14s - 2588.5s

I worked for him for five years.

Speaker 172588.6s - 2595.66s

We built them more than an athlete mantra and everything athlete empowerment. The most thing important to LeBron PERSON is things are earned, not given.

Speaker 02596.04s - 2613.44s

You can't go into a situation pushing athlete empowerment and it's really athlete entitlement. You have to go in there with the leverage that you've earned from the way that you played first in order to truly have that kind of leverage. Otherwise, you run the risk of ruining it for the people that come in behind you.

Speaker 142613.62s - 2616.66s

That's fundamental and that goes across any industry. All right, we got to go.

Speaker 172616.66s - 2619.44s

I was going to push back on the LeBron PERSON point. Real quick, sorry, Shannon PERSON,

Speaker 72619.54s - 2621.86s

just from the simple fact that he's actually from Ohio GPE.

Speaker 172622.16s - 2624.3s

So, I mean, I thought that's kind of a moot point.

Speaker 72624.66s - 2632.4s

He would have stayed hometown. Shoulder and Eli PERSON have something that most people don't have, their daddy got money. Most of these guys ain't coming from money.

Speaker 22632.72s - 2640.4s

Marvin Harrison Jr. PERSON got something these other guys don't have. They want to go to L.A. Why did he go to Miami GPE? Bigger markets. Sexier play.

Speaker 142640.78s - 2648.16s

I'm just being honest, guys. Okay. We got to go. Got to go, guys. Shannon PERSON, don't forget, we got a little friendly wager going, right? You counter the field. That's what you said to me.

Speaker 72648.44s - 2653.96s

Yep, yep. And you know what I took. So let's just remember, okay? You'll be shopping real soon, buddy. See you in the morning. See you tomorrow.