Destiny 2: Final Shape Gameplay Brought Back the Hype - Fireteam Chat

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Based on the Pulitzer Prize winning novel by Vietnam GPE. What if I told you that I was a communist NORP spy? How did you become this? The Sympathizer WORK_OF_ART, streaming April 14th on Max ORG. Subscription required. Welcome to Fire Team Chat, IGN's Destiny Show ORG.

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Thank you so much for joining us. Joining me is Fran Mirabelle PERSON over on the right. Good to see you, Fran PERSON. What's up? And Ty guy Travis in the right. Good to see you, Fran PERSON. What's up? And Ty Guy Travis PERSON in the middle. Thank you for joining me, you too.

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It's happening.

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Good to be here. It is happening. If you haven't been paying attention or don't know who we are, this is IGN ORG's official destiny show. And today, Bunji ORG just had a pretty big reveal in the form of the final shapegameplay. Man, first question to the panel and I'm a little rusty, so sorry to anybody listening or what to why.

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It's going to make it better.

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I know it. It's been a while.

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But what was your overall reaction

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to this? Because I really, really enjoyed

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it. And I'm actually excited about Destiny PRODUCT. Travis PERSON, what are your thoughts? Yeah.

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So as somebody who hasn't really left Destiny PRODUCT, I still do talk about Destiny PRODUCT a ton. I was pretty down on Destiny after Lightfall ORG. I did review that for IGN and gave it a 6 out of 10, I think. And since then, I think they've floundered a little bit with keeping the community engaged.I'm especially worried about story, which I think is still a concern I have. But as somebody who was not expecting a new faction, who didn't see a new subclass coming, especially one as interesting and different as this one, right out the gate, I was already sort of like, eyebrows raised, okay? And then by the end, I was sort of like, all right, we might actually have a real expansion here. So I'm fully excited about this. I have way more hope for the final shape than I ever have since it was announced.So very cool, I thought.

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Fran PERSON, lots that I've into here, a new enemy subclass. We have a new class item where you can combine exotic traits. And of course, a new cool subclass. What have a new class item where you can combine exotic traits. And of course, a new cool subclass. What were your overall thoughts and reactions? Yeah, you know, it's

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interesting hearing from, I think Travis might play more regularly, but I play all of the seasons.

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I always do all of the story content. I do basically all the content, but I dive in, I dive out.

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I don't really grind. Like I don't go for like perfect crafting roles and stuff like that. So in other words, I don't think I get as burnout as some players, which Destin GPE, I'm sure, over the many years of doing the show, we can relate on like going through those motions and sort of predicting how people are going to feel between the release of expansions. But I'm like, Travis PERSON, I think I'm actually like, they seem to be doing what I expected. I was, I've remained excited, remained optimistic about Final Shape WORK_OF_ART.Seeing it, I'm so excited. But oddly, this gameplay reveal, the way they set it up, I think, it's so deep into like, you've got new classes, new things that combine, new things to grind for. And I was like, I thought it was going to be a little more of like sort of a campaign like sizzler preview with some of these details. Right. So after 10 years, I'm like, they're doing what I expected.We finally got, you know, a new class of enemies. We finally got a new another subclass. Travis PERSON, do you want to respond to that?

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Yeah.

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More Samo, same all.

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They finally did all the things we've been asking for. I'm not down. Not good enough for Fran PERSON.

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I didn't say it.

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For Fran PERSON's point, if you were,

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if you were hoping for campaign and story focus,

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that is the part I'm most worried about because,

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you know, Destiny PRODUCT has never really quite hit it with story. And the one time they did was with the witch queen, which had all of this buildup and like character stuff. And I don't feel we've gotten that with the witness, who kind of is just a blank slate, uga boogga monster. And I've really wanted to dive into that. And so I think Fran PERSON's point is well taken, which is that the campaign and story stuff, I'mstill personally worried about. But given that during the initial reveal, they only showed the subjugator, I thought that like the torment reveal, they only showed the subjugator. I thought that like the tormentor, that was all we were going to get, which was so disappointing to me. I talked about that online a ton about how, you know, we're apparently all these pyramid ships are just empty, right?

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We've been waiting for them to come forever and they have only just the witness and that's it. And so that was a bummer, but it's good to see I was wrong about that. And then in terms of the subclasses and the depth, and it really seems like they're just kind of swinging for the fences. So I'm heartened by that stuff. But to France GPE's point, I think he does make a good point, which is, you know,I don't really know how the story's going to land or how much they're focusing on it.

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So I do want to be clear, though, they're doing what I wanted.

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And finally it's happening, right? Finally, another subclass, we all wanted it. Finally, you know, another enemy faction. But my point is, it's happening right finally another subclass we all wanted it finally you know another uh enemy faction but my point is it's actually not about the story and all that i mean i agree with you on all those points but i'm actually it's like the gameplay stuff right so it's very much about me getting excited to play destiny again in a new expansion right and when i look at it i'mlike oh sweet it's more explosive powers, more things to grind for. But I didn't walk away with like, oh, man, like that looks like it's going to be so fun to explore. You know, and to be fair, there's more to be seen. So I'm still excited for it, just to be clear. But they're doing what I expected.And they should. It's been, you know, a 10-year journey and it's been a couple delays to get here.

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So, Fran, would you say that you're happy? They're finally shaping the game out to be something that you were expecting from the get-go? Destin GPE has been smirking for the last

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two minutes with that one. And I just thought he was laughing at seeing me, you know, do my thing

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as usual. But of course, you had a joke lined up. One of the things...

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It is the first enemy faction in six years.

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I forgot how long it's been since forsaken, but that's 2018, man.

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For full faction.

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And even some of the other ones like taken, I totally consider them a full-fledged faction,

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but they are kind of every other faction combined.

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And then even scorn are kind of like a different version of Fallen PRODUCT.

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This is the first like real completely new characters,

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there's even flying creatures. Yeah. And so to me, that's like a huge event for Destiny PRODUCT. I mean, we never get that.

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This new enemy type,

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the dread, uh, you brought up the flying character that has a screech ability that will basically, you know, uh,dampen your abilities or take them away temporarily. That is a really, really that will basically, you know, dampen your abilities or take them away temporarily. That is a really, really compelling mechanic that, you know, will definitely keep you on your toes. And some of the other characters, including the weaver and the attendant, where they're going to use strand and stasis against you, where they'll pull you into battle,as opposed to shield bash you into a wall to die. You know, I like it. I like how they're playing with these things. And the husk, what we know is the husk has like a specific way to be killed. And if you don't do it right, you get a seeker. I feel like there was another enemy type that did that.

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I can't remember who. From which queen, the, um, the snipers.

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Yeah.

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No, the little like, you know, the bug thing. The fiber guy, you know know you had to shoot the spark

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thing that flew you after oh yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah reminiscent of that i can't believe i'm forgetting

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that but yeah so uh that's it's all interesting mechanics and it's a new enemy type and they

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look really cool they have like yeah gigantic wings sprouting out of their back and and it's

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definitely going to add a lot of life that i think the game has needed for a long time.

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Enemy Class Edition PRODUCT is very important and very welcome.

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Yeah.

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Yeah, I don't want to take the air out of it with my like sort of,

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oh, it's been 10 years. They finally did it. You know, I've been very optimistic on Destiny PRODUCT while many players are just burnout, right? But anyway, when I saw the gun bat, as they joked about it, I got super excited because I'm really into Diablo PRODUCT and I love the explosiveness of Diablo. And you can see those influences on Destiny PRODUCT over time, right? We went from, if you go back to the first Destiny PRODUCT to where we are now, things have just gotten so like the hordes of enemies, explosive particles everywhere.And like, I like that. And it looks to be delivering even more on that fantasy. It kind of in a way has gone full RPG when you look at it visually, I think, with some of these powers and enemies. And I think that's going to be a ton of fun.

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Well, let's, let's dive into that a little bit more because, Travis PERSON, they're doing some pretty drastic overhauls that they're teasing. They think it might break the game.

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And for once, I don't think they're being hyperbolic. So you're going to be able to have a new

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exotic class item that combines two traits that can be from other subclasses and they're randomly rolled.

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Obviously, there's probably going to be a perk set that you can get on each class item so the game doesn't like totally get broken. But that's really, really compelling. And that's in addition to the

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prismatic new subclass, which allows you to combine light and darkness. And then there's the transcendent abilities. It seems like you're really, really going to get in there and figure out how to min-max your character build in a lot of interesting ways. What are your thoughts, Travis PERSON, on those changes?

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Yeah, I think the entire first half of the stream was so geared toward hardcore players. It really did shock me because if you're a casual Destiny PRODUCT player and you hear about a new subclass, they get you excited. But when the subclass is like so technical and advanced and about like synergies and combining these things and it's got this extra layer of kind of like a second super you're managing.Um, they really surprised me how, how in depth that is. And then the exotic class item where you can combine two different features, uh, from different exotics that strikes me as like the ultimate chase this forever item. You know, like people who love to farm the game and just like grind and grind and grind, they're going to be looking for like, you know, every combination of every two exotic perks that can possibly roll in this thing and trying to get like that perfect match.And I think it's going to make things really interesting. Unfortunately, it's probably going to completely destroy PVP. I mean, I don't see how it could have to do that. I mean, it's like, because I mean, we didn't even survive Stasis PRODUCT. We all remember that. I mean, it's going to be, it's going to be pretty crazy to watch them try to adapt.

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Well, strain in Stasis, yeah.

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That's the whole M.O, right? Break the PVP sandbox for like a month and then bring things in line, you know? A month is generous. I think you mean like six months.

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Yeah, they're usually, they usually leave it broken for quite a while.

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But yeah, or sometimes years. But I am really excited by the prospect of this stream really seemed to me to cater to like hardcore players. Because usually when you see streams like this, it looks a lot like the last stream where it's just kind of like broad strokes. And it's showing, hey, here's the bad guy. And here's some of the vistas you're going to be visiting and that sort of stuff. And we didn't really get that with this one.We got a little bit of a sizzle trailer at the end, but both the prismatic and the new exotic class item, they both struck me as just like 100% design for hardcore people who want to play this for years. I think they needed to do that because they are losing a lot of their hardcore players, or at least there's a lot of hardcore players saying, you know, I think I'm retiring after the final shape because to France GPE point,they're burned out. And I think this is a really good olive branch to possibly keep them around. I don't know how it's going to go over for casual players, though, because it also strikes me as really complicated. I don't know if you guys caught this, but they put status effects now on both sides of the screen.You know how usually it's always on the left side. Now it's on both sides. So my guess is you're going to have like a light and darkness and just like that it's more kind of chunky now than I think it's ever been. So I think it's going to be a little confusing for some.

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Yeah, you you hit on the point, which is where I think my original comment came

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from. I was a little surprised. It was so like immediately in the weeds, right? You're watching something seconds in that that everyone else who's like, I wonder what they're doing with Final Shape WORK_OF_ART. I haven't played in years.It's like just this explosive looks like destiny too, you know? And they did more messaging on like new, new enemy types and all. I would have reversed that obviously of like, yeah, what excited me was new enemies and you know, hopefully get a preview of like the pale heart, like something from it. We did in August, to be fair, but we didn't see much. So anyway, what I was going to get at, you're right. I think this is for the hardcore, the peoplewho are listening like two months before. And to be fair, there's going to be more messaging. And they might do that closer to when it's actually out on June 4th.

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more messaging and they might do that closer to when it's actually out on June 4th. I mean, for me, I welcome the fact that it was more for the hardcore player because I don't think that you should count out your casual Destiny PRODUCT fan as wanting a little bit more meat on the

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bones, so to speak, when it comes to Destiny PRODUCT too. For me, I've made a few videos now about like why I've barely touched Destiny in the last year, how I feel constantly strung along by the story. It's like every seasonal arc happens and then it just seems to come to a conclusion with a bunch of loose ends. Things never feel really wrapped up with a bow.So far what I've seen about the final shape, we know that there's going to be a raid where we're finally going to take on the witness. This ideally will wrap up a lot of those loose ends. But my question to the panel is, well, Destin GPE is excited. And I'm sure a lot of

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long-time fans are sort of excited. Do you think this is going to be enough to bring back the

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majority of players? Or do you think that they do have a bit of an uphill battle with, you know,

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all the challenges Bungy ORG has right now with getting their players to, to come back in a big way. Because Lightfall ORG left a lot of people feeling not misled, but just let down, I think would be the way to put it. And I'm curious, do you think Final Shape WORK_OF_ART is going to bring back the audience the game once had and a new

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audience? I'll start with you, Travis. Yeah, I think it 100% depends on what they deliver. I think they showed with Witch Queen WORK_OF_ART that if they deliver good content, the people will come, right? And it doesn't matter if some people have lapsed because if it's good content, people will come back for the content. I've actually been a critic of Bungie ORG's insistence on trying to keep people engaged forever.Because to me me that seems like a recipe for disaster like ideally you want people to come when you have good content to play and then once they're done stop and come back when you have more and I think that if the final shape delivers it has a chance to bring a ton of people back I think it will bring back the hardcore because you don't play nine years of a game and then leave

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right at the finale right they're going to want to see how that goes but i my biggest worry isn't really about the final shape it's about what comes after because in the same way that mc u ORG sort of lost a lot of its fuel after the conclusion of you know the infinity wars arc EVENT you know this could this could be that sort of thing where people are like all right they're going to keep making it but my part in it is done i'm just going to kind of tune out and go back to my life before. And I think that there's a big potential for that to happen if they don't have a really good plan or surprise us in some way. But generally speaking, I think if you make good content, people will come back, regardless of how long they haven't played. And I think sometimes the break is a good thing.

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Really, it can be.

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I hear you on that, Travis PERSON. We just put together a little feature on IGN ORG. You can go check out the full thing there. But Fran PERSON, for some context, we do know that Cade PRODUCT has been teased. The pale heart is going inside of the traveler.We do know that there are a few expansions coming with that. I believe the expansions are Echoes, Revenant, and Heresy PRODUCT. And they will continue the story past the initial campaign release. Episodes are a bit different than seasons. So that aspect is changing. And they're going to be released every three weeks with each individual episode in having three acts, each of which will be released every six weeks. So in terms of content to support after the initial launch, and I pulled all that right from bungee.

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Bungy dot, bungee.com or whatever their website is. So, uh, yeah.

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Expansions, the names of them. I hadn't heard that expansions or the episodic content.

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Episodes.

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Episodes.

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Right.

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Just to be clear, right?

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Like, yeah, because I was surprised.

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You nailed me on terminology.

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So no, I, you know, it's easy to miss stuff.

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I legitimately was confused for a second.

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Yeah, absolutely.

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So, yeah, so they're doing something very different than seasons.

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So first question, just giving that context to you about like what they have planned

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post launch to address Travis PERSON's point.

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But going back to you, Fran PERSON, what is your thought? Is this going to bring in a new audience and bring back old fans to see the story out. I mean, it's a whole can of worms why people play Destiny PRODUCT. If all three of us go through, why I actually wanted to ask that, maybe you want to cover that because I think you're going to find it's very different for each person. And what I mean by that is I think we need a few more episodes to cover everything.But you hit on something that I think is super important. And that is what I'm excited to see more of which is we remember in taking King like oryx you know that boss being something you chased and knew of through those stories is very powerful and we've now been doing that with witness PERSON and I hope throughout going through the raid and all we see some similar arc there I think that could be very powerful for the final shape ifthat's how they handle it you know this villain versus like there's always somebody new at the end of the raid

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kind of. So I think from a story and presentation side and a new world to play in, I do think that it's going to draw in just naturally, people who haven't played in a while, but messaging-wise, like we've been talking about, I'm waiting to see that stream from them. Because if I haven't played in years or even if I'm like, you know what, we finally took that break, I think I'm kind of like, Destiny PRODUCT's cool, but it looks like Destiny, right? I don't think this stream sells you on like all the new gameplay. It's how your play is changing.Yeah. I mean, would you guys agree with that? I watched a stream that's like how I'm playing in a game that looks very familiar to me is continuing to deepen. And I'm like, wow,

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that looks like a lot of fun. But the reason I play to keep my part short on that, I'm always down for the new content. So like the new dungeon was dope. I know they can't release a new dungeon every

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month. A new strike, right, is always dope. I think that as well, those, that type of excitement for me seeing like, how is this new strike with the mechanics going to play out? Because we've stood on plates, we've dunked balls, you know where I'm going with the rest of the mechanics. And there's nothing wrong with those, but it's been 10 years. And so, you know, things like placing turrets down and onslaught and all, we'll see how that integrates. But that's the stuff that excites me. The little, you know, there's no skill, there's subclass skill trees, but meaning when we learn Strand PRODUCT even, it just kind of got dumped in our lap and like I like a, you know,like I'm playing Horizon for Ben West PERSON right now. And like I like a rollout of like learning all these new skills and stuff. And it's very different for Destiny, which has been out 10 years. But that's what I'm looking to see hopefully hopefully, in the coming months of just sort of how that could be fun for someone to come back and just play for 10 hours and not have to play for 100, to your point.Yeah.

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The second part of your question, this one, was about new players.

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I do think they have almost no chance of getting new players.

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I would be shocked.

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Really?

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Because, yeah, they basically gave up on their new light program.

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Like they recently announced, I think just last week that they're now making it skippable, I guess,

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because people didn't really, didn't really, didn't really attach with them. And, you know,

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you usually don't sign on to play it right when it's at the end. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe if they

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really deliver and it just, you know, it becomes like a must play and catches on fire on the internet,

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I think they have a chance.

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But it does seem like they've sort of boxed themselves into like a dedicated player base.

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And they're appealing to that with this stream certainly. So I don't know.

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I'd be pretty shocked if they had a whole bunch of new players. That's an interesting deduction. I would ask it the other way, though, is don't you think they're like, you know what? This is not super fun. Let's just let them hop straight into the final shape. I mean, could it be that they're trying to get them in faster?

Speaker 61288.38s - 1302.96s

I think that is the intent, but I think they've kind of admitted that their onboarding problem is still a problem. And I don't know if you, I recently did a kind of social experiment where I had two of my friends hop onto Destiny for the first time and play.

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And then I interviewed them. I interviewed them when they played it. And then I interviewed them. I interviewed them when they played it. And then I interviewed them like a year later to see how they were doing. And like the drop off was pretty hard. Both of them lapsed. One of them went really deep down the rabbit hole.One of them bopped off right in way.

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But both of their criticism was like immediately and is a good retention rate.

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Yeah.

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No, no.

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No, no. They both they both lapsed, is my point. But one of them went down the rabbit hole for like six months and then ended up quitting. And when both of them interviewed them the second time, they both told me like, yeah, the onboarding was just brutal. Like you basically have to have friends who are willing to, like, guide you through.

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Yeah.

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Yeah, it's tough, man.

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It's really hard to get into this game.

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You know, shout out to Fire Team Finder PRODUCT though. And I'm really curious to see if they can pull that together in a way that like, I would love to log into the final shape and see a more central director, right, the map of the universe, which is baffling between getting to your quests. And I would love to see a revamp of that. But at a minimum, Fire Team Finder PRODUCT, I think, should be a centerpiece.

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Like, it's not quite there because it's in beta, right? But to find it, you go into your friends list.

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Or you can select an activity and then find it.

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But I would love to see it just more at the center of an activity. A little bit of an aside to that. So I think they kind of tried that with seasonal content, because I really didn't like season of the deep. So I came back to it with the current season that's ongoing right now. And when I played it, it was very, very difficult to find a team.And the only way you can utilize the Fire Team Finder PRODUCT is to play that specific content for, well, I'm explaining that in a weird way. So the way I had to use Fire Team Finder was for that specific content and just nobody was really matchmaking for that. So I couldn't get a team together. And it's a lot of the same problems that they encountered when they were trying

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to do the old style matchmaking. Like they did. Yeah, the raid and a camera, what else they did it for. But yeah, same problems that they've had for a long time. You end up using an external tool, right? Right.

Speaker 41428.44s - 1437.72s

Well, but this is why I bring it up is that recently one advancement they made is they brought forward to the Destiny PRODUCT app, I think, is Fire Team Finders PRODUCT the same thing, or it's going to be.

Speaker 01437.82s - 1449.92s

Maybe it's not in there yet. But if it's at the center, the idea is that you wouldn't go through that desk because everybody's thinking it used in it. So for anybody out there who hasn't used it, excuse me, highly recommend you do a

Speaker 41449.92s - 1473.26s

nightfall on, I think legend mode is the one just above here or whatever where like you can't matchmake, but you can find a fire team, finder team. And you will always fight. At least I have on PC, but I have crossplay on it. Man, there's these like super hungry players that just want to keep grinding it. And man, you get Boku rewards. The point is for me, when I did that, I was like, I remember talking about this on the show

Speaker 01473.26s - 1475.5s

Destin, like, you know, 10 years ago.

Speaker 51475.5s - 1478.5s

Like we need it. It should have been there. Yeah.

Speaker 41478.5s - 1479.5s

Yeah.

Speaker 51479.5s - 1481.88s

We joke like, I've played enough destiny.

Speaker 41481.88s - 1483.94s

We'll figure it out. What's the worst that could happen?

Speaker 01483.94s - 1485.82s

Send me a warning we would joke, right? That you might fail. Well, they've finally done it. We'll figure it out. What's the worst that could happen? Send me a warning, we would joke, right?

Speaker 51485.9s - 1486.92s

That you might fail.

Speaker 01487.3s - 1498.26s

Well, they've finally done it. And actually, it's really promising. But again, it's not at the center. If you use Fire Team Finder PRODUCT, it's, if you haven't seen, it's got like categories, like, story campaign.

Speaker 51498.5s - 1502.02s

Yeah, like season of the deep. And nobody is looking for it. Yeah.

Speaker 41502.32s - 1504.76s

But dungeons are a better use case.

Speaker 51505.36s - 1505.5s

Yeah. Yeah. Dungeons are too. But my point is you have to crawl into the finder to find it. Yeah, but, but dungeons are a better use case. Yeah.

Speaker 41505.88s - 1506.08s

Yeah,

Speaker 51506.2s - 1524.34s

dungeons are too. But my point is you have to crawl into the finder to find it. What I want to do is log in and like, that's a huge piece of it that gets more people in because without it, you will find a fire team. Yeah.Travis PERSON, have you experimented with it at all using the, the new fire team finder? No, I got friends. I'm cool.I'm telling you,

Speaker 41524.34s - 1528.72s

like your experiments, do fire team findinder nightfall if you play PVE.

Speaker 61529.12s - 1533.04s

And I guarantee you'll be like, huh, that was interesting, you know, it's surprising.

Speaker 51534.14s - 1535.86s

So, I do need to try it.

Speaker 61536.36s - 1544.76s

Like, meaning imagine logging in, just to finish the point, I'd complain that I couldn't just log in for like 30 minutes, do a high end nightfall.

Speaker 51544.88s - 1546.96s

It was like such a chore to find a team.

Speaker 41547.04s - 1548.12s

And now you can do it.

Speaker 61548.32s - 1549.72s

25 minutes, boom, done.

Speaker 41549.8s - 1550.14s

It's pretty great.

Speaker 51550.22s - 1555.76s

Rewards. Yeah. It's good for dads like me that have to run away and take care of the kids. It's a while.

Speaker 61556.32s - 1557.52s

I am sort of curious.

Speaker 41557.82s - 1560.12s

So the last expansion was lightfall PRODUCT.

Speaker 61560.2s - 1575.06s

And I think for many players, it was sort of a letdown, a pretty substantial letdown with a lot of key story elements, didn't feel explained in a way that really did the story service, kind of abruptly ended on a cliffhanger.

Speaker 51575.48s - 1610.38s

And overall, I think the sentiment was negative about lightfall PRODUCT. So with that context, how are you feeling going into final shape? I know you've sort of alluded to story. But for me, we've heard the internal talks about how they need it to be like the best story ever. It's very important to Bungy ORG also. You know, Luke Smith PERSON opened up the event that we just watched talking about how the team is excited.But how are you all feeling about this story? I'm excited about it, but I'm cautiously optimistic is my take. Fran PERSON, what do you think? Yeah, I don't know, man.

Speaker 41610.38s - 1615.12s

It's hard to answer that one because I need to see more, like I said.

Speaker 01615.12s - 1623.32s

I've been excited to see the 10-year expansion. I think Bungie has put in a ton of work, and we're seeing the beginnings of that.

Speaker 41623.32s - 1629.5s

But I don't know if I'm avoiding the question too much here. I don't know what to say without seeing more.

Speaker 51629.5s - 1635.24s

What's your hype level on the story out of this one to 10? What's your VPH on it?

Speaker 41635.24s - 1638.82s

What came to me was my power per hour, right?

Speaker 51638.82s - 1653.18s

But what came to me when you said that Destin GPE was I just watched like the story trailer for Star Wars WORK_OF_ART outlaws, you know? Yeah. Star Wars Outlaw WORK_OF_ART. And because like I know so much about I'm not a Star Wars WORK_OF_ART nerd, but like it's in my veins. You'd think destiny would feel similarly, right? Mm-hmm.

Speaker 61653.88s - 1657.94s

But when I think about the final shape, I'm like, I don't know, the witness seems pretty cool.

Speaker 41658.18s - 1658.78s

And I can't.

Speaker 51658.78s - 1661.86s

Who is the witness even, you know?

Speaker 41662s - 1673.56s

I get where you're coming from. But you see what I mean? When I, I don't even know really the story depth of Star Wars outlaw from Ubisoft ORG there. But like I got excited. I was like, this feels like it could be a lot of fun, you know?Yeah.

Speaker 61674.52s - 1674.82s

Travis PERSON?

Speaker 41675.64s - 1676.06s

Yeah.

Speaker 61676.72s - 1691.26s

So I think Bungy ORG's storytelling has been really hit or miss, especially with destiny. And so I'm sort of cautiously pessimistic, I guess would be the best way to put it. Like I, I, I don't want to be hurt again.

Speaker 11691.26s - 1762.84s

So I'm sort of just kind of assuming it's going to be like a, uh, a, you know, you got to get, get to a mortar and then kill the bad guy and that that's going to be it. And if it, if it is just that, you know, then I'll, I'll be like, okay, that wasn't anything special and I won't be hurt. But if I'm pleasantly surprised and it ends up being at or above the level of the witch queen, because they've shown that they can tell good stories. The witch queen is a good story, period, not just a good story for destiny, which I think is a qualifier. A lot of us are used totalking about when we talk about stories and destiny. And so to me, I think Lightfall ORG was a misstep because that expansion, in my opinion, was probably not planned, you know? It seems like it was sort of a stop-get measure because they needed more time for the end of the game. And I think that that's, that that showed in its quality and it's kind of haphazard approach to storytelling. I'm really hoping they turned things around.Bungie ORG did send me the collector's edition for the expansion, which had a lore book that talked about the witness and the stuff that's going on in the background. And I will say that lore book really impressed me. I read it and I think it was some of the best lore they've written.

Speaker 01762.96s - 1786.28s

And so if they can find a way to get some of that story into the game, I think they have a chance to tell a really good story. But they have shown in the past, sometimes they leave the good stories in the lore books. And I really hope that doesn't happen. I hope they go the way of which queen and get some of that lore in the story and in the cutscenes. I'm crossing my fingers. But I'm going to be I'm going to be cautiously pessimistic on this one just because I don't think their track record is great.

Speaker 51786.82s - 1806.38s

In addition to all of this happening with final shape and, you know, our overall reactions to it and cautious optimism, I think, seems to be the consensus for the panel here. How are you feeling about the content that came out today? Into the Light launch today. It has the new onslaught wave-based mode.

Speaker 01807.34s - 1813.2s

And, well, I'll keep my opinion for last, but I would love to hear from y'all and what

Speaker 61813.2s - 1813.58s

you think.

Speaker 01813.68s - 1813.9s

Travis PERSON?

Speaker 61815.7s - 1818.94s

Into the Light WORK_OF_ART didn't really interest me too much.

Speaker 51819.42s - 1823.12s

The wave-based mode kind of seems like a greatest hits type game where you're just kind

Speaker 61823.12s - 1861.54s

of mindlessly shooting things and then getting a bunch of guns that I've already acquired up to five times in Destiny's history, Hung Jerry PERSON. And so, yeah. And so I initially it kind of didn't really interest me, but now that I've got a little bit more hype and hope for Final Shape WORK_OF_ART, I probably am going to hop in tonight and play some of it because I don't know. I just, it feels like a good way to kind of summarize and recap destiny and just have some mindless fun with friends and talk about the expansion and what we're excited for and kind of just get back in the groove of destiny before the final shape comes out because I am reviewingit. So I got to know what I'm talking about here. Fran PERSON, what did you think?

Speaker 41862.92s - 1872.7s

Yeah. Before the end of the light, just the cap off, I did want to say that I think in the way they deliver for witch queen, I'm absolutely optimistic for Final Shape WORK_OF_ART. Like, to Travis PERSON' point, that was a bit of a stopgap.

Speaker 31872.78s - 1880.62s

And I don't judge Lightfall is where I think, I think Final Shape will deliver at least in the way it's like even Taking King and Forsaken WORK_OF_ART and all that.

Speaker 01880.86s - 1882.96s

Whoa, you think it's going to be the next Taken King PERSON?

Speaker 51883.7s - 1884.78s

Fran Mirabella PERSON.

Speaker 41885.92s - 1887.3s

No one. It's the next Taken King or Forsaken WORK_OF_ART.

Speaker 51887.9s - 1890.24s

You heard of the... Come on. The Witch Queen's

Speaker 61890.24s - 1892.4s

story is better than the Taken King's story. Come on.

Speaker 41893.64s - 1895.7s

You know, it's interesting. They go together, don't they?

Speaker 61895.86s - 1898.04s

Like, without one, you can't... I feel like you can't

Speaker 41898.04s - 1900s

have the other, right? Kind of. But the

Speaker 61900s - 1911.5s

Taken King, I think, puts most of its story in the Book of Sorrows, right? Like, that's where you really get all of the lore. And the witch queen had like some of that stuff happening in cutscenes. It had two twists, dude.

Speaker 41911.68s - 1914.36s

It had two, like actually like shocking twists.

Speaker 61914.74s - 1915.5s

That's pretty crazy.

Speaker 41915.5s - 1917s

We take it for granted.

Speaker 61917.16s - 1920.98s

But anyway, my point was I think at the very least that, but meaning the story can be

Speaker 41920.98s - 1922.38s

confusing for all of us.

Speaker 61922.82s - 1954.5s

For Into the Light WORK_OF_ART, they surprised me. I thought it was just going to be a free activity. We even knew about the wave-based stuff coming. I thought like that probably the most of it. Kind of like Guardian Games ORG Plus, you know, with a special. And I think that's fair, right, to stretch out a two or three-month period that they delayed the game.But bringing back, you know, the exotic missions and all this stuff, it surprised me and those are fan favorites. So I think they did a great job with that, considering it's free content, right? I mean, we gotta remember this is stretching.

Speaker 01954.5s - 1955.76s

It is old.

Speaker 41955.76s - 1971.28s

Yeah, it is not an episode or an expansion. And so on that front, I still need to actually play Onslaught PRODUCT. I couldn't tell you what I think of the activity, but would be cool to go back to those exotic missions, have a little fun. But my eyes remain mostly fixed on the final shape and learning more about it.

Speaker 51971.78s - 1984s

Well, I have not played the new content yet. And I'm still behind the most recent season, season of the Wish ORG. I do want to say that I think Season of the Haunted was one of the best seasons that Destiny PRODUCT has done in a long time.

Speaker 01984.3s - 2026.74s

Granted it was a little grindy, but the story beats that they hit there with Zavala PERSON's past and all of the different characters passed. I thought that was really, really interesting stuff. My temperature gauge for Into the Light WORK_OF_ART is tepid. I am not going in super hype. I will probably sign on after we record this and give it a go, see what's going on in Into the light, because it is sort of the thing that we'll be doing for the next two months. And I am curious. But yeah, not super hype, not super down on it. I'm just sort of like, okay, I mean, like they add a new stuff. I'll check it out and see if it's worth my time. Real quick, currently, like right now with Destiny PRODUCT, where are you sitting at?

Speaker 52026.82s - 2052s

I've talked publicly about how I'm not playing too much. I am sort of interested into the light, and I will tell you right now I am very, very hype for Final Shape WORK_OF_ART. The more I see about it, the more I am very interested in seeing how the light and darkness saga wraps up. And if that is my end with my time with destiny, time will tell with that,but I'm very intrigued by the journey that Bungy ORG will take us on through the finale. Travis PERSON, what are your thoughts?

Speaker 62053.14s - 2065.44s

Yeah. So I still play Destiny PRODUCT pretty regularly, but I definitely have come off of it a little bit just because, you know, burnout. And my goal with Destiny PRODUCT is always to not hate it. Right.

Speaker 02065.44s - 2109.86s

And so whatever I've got to do to not hate destiny. Yeah. Whatever I've got to do to not hate destiny. If that means playing it a little less, not grinding for some of the stuff, not participating in every season of the dawning or whatever, I've got to bake cookies for. And so I definitely still play it.I've definitely taken a step back from grinding it until I hate myself, though, which I think has been healthy for my relationship with destiny. So I'm excited to jump back in, but I always, always play the seasons, the expansions. I do our reviews for the expansion. So obviously, I'm going to be playing a ton when this one comes out. And yeah, I'm just, I'm excited to be excited about destiny. And I'm luckily in a position right now where I currently am not like sick of it, right? Because I gave myself a little bit of

Speaker 32109.86s - 2114.14s

breathing room, played a little bit less than I normally do, which has been, I think, uh, healthy and

Speaker 02114.14s - 2119.56s

something more destiny players should do. Step away. Step away a little bit. It's okay. You don't have to

Speaker 12119.56s - 2124.52s

get every, every craftable weapon. You can, you can chill. So, Brian? I mean, we warned them,

Speaker 42124.52s - 2125.36s

Destin for years.

Speaker 62125.44s - 2129.66s

I feel like we told players, like, stop burning yourself out because it makes you so mad.

Speaker 42129.66s - 2145.02s

And then you come back anyway, eventually, and you're happier. But yeah, people burn themselves out. I think this forced hiatus that they gave you was a good thing. Some people might walk away forever, but some people realize they're like, you know what? I don't need to grind for every last weapon. I don't have the vault space for it anyway.Yeah. Where are you at overall with Destiny, though, Fran PERSON? to grind for every last weapon. I don't have the vault space for it anyway. Yeah.

Speaker 52145.44s - 2147.56s

Where are you at overall with Destiny, though, Fran PERSON?

Speaker 42147.62s - 2211.22s

Because there's two questions there. There's like the final shape hype that I'm feeling today. But overall, like, where are you at with the game in your life? Yeah. As I've always said, bungee magic, destiny is always such a good feeling, impressive game. And it's easy to talk about it in a way where you're like,well, I'm looking for, and right, I'm looking for a lot, but it's still a super impressive game. And so I always enjoy playing it. Yeah, I've never grinded it so much that I burn myself out. And something I would bring up, you know, and pointing to the way people, the ways people play, people are always surprised when I say this. Lightfall ORG is one of my most played releases. Now, that's around Lightfall ORG. Because people, like, who play Destiny PRODUCT,they talk about Lightfall ORG in a way, like, come on. Like, even Witch Queen WORK_OF_ART, great story. You didn't keep playing the campaign and story by majority. You played everything else over and over crafting your weapons. But Lightfall ORG was so impressive because they added loadouts. They got rid of the affinity of fixes.Oh my God, it drove me nuts.

Speaker 02211.22s - 2219.28s

All of a sudden, I was able to like start to like play the game and I just hop in this one I'm strand, hop in that one on arc and like didn't have to like look at my

Speaker 42219.28s - 2236.8s

mods and be like, should I use like a browser for this part? You know, and it got me to the point where I was just like vibe and just really enjoyed it. And again, I wasn't burn out when I arrived. So on that front, I still play that way. I always play all the seasonal content, all the raids, all the dungeons. But I don't grind, grind, grind, grind.

Speaker 02236.88s - 2239.28s

And there's nothing wrong with that if you enjoy it.

Speaker 42239.52s - 2247.14s

But if like you've hinted Travis PERSON, you find yourself with a little bit of sour taste in your mouth, just take the break. You're not going to miss anything, you know?

Speaker 32248.08s - 2254.72s

So again, destiny is a top experience for me, but playing it for 10 years, I'm always looking

Speaker 42254.72s - 2272.06s

for something new. And that's like I joked about mechanics, but it's true. So the enemies are going to help. Mechanics help a ton, but even just the way we play a strike, right? Like, I want to see, is the design changing in any way? Or is it just more of the same, but it's deeper, if that makes sense.

Speaker 52272.36s - 2274.32s

And that could be fun, but I'm looking for more.

Speaker 42275.5s - 2275.74s

I hear, yeah.

Speaker 52276.64s - 2300.08s

Fran, Travis, I do want to thank you for joining me on the show today. Before I do the outro, though, I do want to address something to the audience. This is not like a guarantee that Fire Team ORG chat is going to be a regular thing again. This is obviously a passion project for myself and my panelists here where we just like to get together and talk about Destiny PRODUCT. So, yeah, Fire Team Chat ORG, right?

Speaker 02300.88s - 2322.38s

Destiny PRODUCT's brought a lot of fun experiences into our life. I just don't want to like over-hype anything. But if we do a few more episodes over the next few weeks, let us know what you think about it. Let us know what you think about the show. I don't know where you're watching.Subscribe. Do all that good stuff, right? But it has been great having you back, Fran PERSON. Thank you for making the time.

Speaker 42323.38s - 2324.78s

Yeah, I'm no longer at IGN ORG.

Speaker 52324.78s - 2326.24s

And so I may not be on

Speaker 42326.24s - 2330.9s

these episodes that he said he's doing so many more. You guys can't just wait for it. No, I'm joking.

Speaker 52331.28s - 2335.76s

But I would love to come back, obviously. I also do Destiny Community ORG podcast live.

Speaker 12335.88s - 2340.58s

We do that every week. And of course, I'm full-time streaming content creator live on Twitch ORG,

Speaker 02341.04s - 2345.8s

FM3 over on Twitch, just my initials. Yeah. And Travis PERSON, I know you're doing a lot

Speaker 12345.8s - 2346.46s

of freelance,

Speaker 52346.56s - 2367.3s

like you're doing the reviews for Destiny PRODUCT and such. Yeah. Thank you for making the time also. If we do another one, you want to come back some time?Yeah, I'll be here whenever you need me, buddy. All right. Fran PERSON, you have a standing invitation, of course. But for this episode,that is it. So until next time, everybody, Guardians out.

Speaker 62367.3s - 2389.46s

Guardians out. Hi. My name. My name is Jenny Owen Youngs PERSON.

Speaker 32390.98s - 2391.2s

And I am Kristen Rousseau PERSON.

Speaker 02397.6s - 2397.8s

And together, we run buffering a rewatch adventure, a family of podcasts moving through our favorite 90s genre television.

Speaker 32401.06s - 2401.22s

If you're a fan of Buffy the Vampire Slayer WORK_OF_ART, well, great news for you.

Speaker 02405.34s - 2416.6s

Our very first podcast adventure took us through all seven seasons of the series. We covered it spoiler-free episode by episode. For those of you who want to start the show for the first time, you can find that podcast pretty easily. It's called Buffering the Vampire Slayer WORK_OF_ART.

Speaker 32417.22s - 2426.34s

Inside that podcast, you'll also find an original song that pairs with each glorious episode of Buffy and original character jingles for so many of our Buffy WORK_OF_ART favorites.

Speaker 02426.78s - 2441.48s

Buffering has been praised in places like Time ORG, Esquire, Paste Magazine, and the New York Times, and we've chatted with dozens of cast members, writers, directors, and fans along the way. Come hang out and rewatch some of your favorite television with us and a wonderful community of listeners.

Speaker 32441.98s - 2446.28s

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