Medtronic’s Seidel Maps out Future for Electrophysiology, Pulsed-Field Ablation Portfolio

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Hey everybody, this is Tom Salome, Device Talks. Welcome back to the Device Talks weekly podcast. We only have two episodes left before Device Talks, Boston. I can't wait to see you all there. The numbers look great. Registrations are pouring in.We're really grateful. It's going to be a fantastic event. If you haven't yet registered, you still have time to do so and actually have a little money-saving tip for you in just a moment. But thanks to everyone who's given the event a lot of buzz on LinkedIn. Thanks to one of our guests today, coincidentally, by the way.I was going to have Scott Nelson a fast wave on anyway. But today he posted a video. He had Jonathan Papabon, former Red Sox Great Closer. Do a little cameo thing, a little shout out to device talks. And frankly, I kind of lost my mind a little bit. I'm still such a baseball nerd.So thanks again to everyone who's giving it the buzz. And I really can't wait to see folks at the Boston Convention Exhibition Center on May 1st and 2nd, but also on April 30th because on April 30th we're going to have our opening reception, our opening networking reception. And that's where the special offer comes in. We are going to have Jeff Karp, who's a professor at Brigham and Wins Hospital.He's at Harvard Medical School. He's going to go over his resume a little bit in the interview. But more recently or most recently, he just launched a book called Lit, which stands for Life Ignition Tools. And the title is,use nature's playbook to energize your brain, spark ideas, and ignite action. So it's quite the appropriate book, and the timing is great because it just came out in April for Device Talks Boston because we're going to talk a lot about innovation. We'll have our innovation forum there with MedTech Innovator, Innovate, Innovate, Innovate.So Jeff Karp will be there on April 30th at the opening reception. He'll have books for sale. He'll be signing books that are purchased. But you also have an opportunity to win some books. If you use the code Lit 25, so it's LIT 25, when you register, you'll save 25% off the price of Device Talks, Boston. And the first 10 folks who do that will get a free book.And we'll give you the book at the conference. So I hope that you take this opportunity to register, to save some money, and to get a great book for yourself. Or as I noted in the interview, it's graduation time. And for high school grads, college grads, this is a great way. It's not a science book. It's a book to sort of reset your brain and to open it up for new opportunities and ideas.So I think it's something we all could do and all could use. And I recommend that folks get it one way or the other way, whether you try to get the free one or whether you buy it at the Vice Talks, Boston, or whether you just go on Amazon and order it. It's really a great read. And I actually used one of the tricks this morning. And I really found it helpful.So check it out. So we'll have Jeff Karp on first. I'll talk with him about the book and about his experiences. Then we'll have Scott Nelson on, my hero, who got Jonathan Pablebond to record a shout out to me and device talks, which was very, very cool. And he was at Fenway Park, but I'm gushing. I'll stop.And then a little later, we'll talk with Rebecca Seidel of Metronic about pulse field depletion and about electrophysiology. So this episode is sponsored by Freudenberg Medical. Thank you to them for sponsoring device talks weekly and a lot of our other great products. We had them on a device talks Tuesday just recently. So thanks to Freudenberg again for supporting device talks.So again, great episode for you. We'll be talking to Jeff Karp. We'll be hearing from Scott Nelson. And a little later, we'll be hearing from Rebecca Seidel of Metronic. Once again, please don't miss out on Device Talks, Boston. You only have a short amount of time to register and to attend.And we'd love to get your registrations in early, so we know exactly what to prepare for. But it's on pace to be our biggest event ever. And as I've said, ad nauseum, as a Boston guy, it's just a great thrill to put together this Boston event. And I really do think it's a can't miss event for MedTech. So go to boston.device.com to register.All right. Let's get this podcast episode started. Remember, when you register, use the code lit 25, save 25% off. And the first 10 folks who do that, get a free book from Jeff Carp called Lit Life Ignition Tools. All right. Now let's get this episode started.All right, you ready for this? Ready.

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Well, Jeff Carr, welcome to the podcast.

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Oh, it's so great to be back. Thank you.

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Yeah, it's great to have you.

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So we've got a really cool topic to talk about. We'll be talking about innovation, a great deal at Device Talks, Boston, which of course coming up in just a couple of weeks. And so it was really timely that I happened upon your book, which is called Lit, and it stands for Life Ignition Tools. And it seemed like Kismet that these would come together at the same time. So I'm happy to discuss this book. I want to get a few of the, pull a few of the gold nuggets out of here, but also wanted to remind folks, in case they miss it up at the top of the podcast, that you'll be at the Vice Talks, Boston. You'll be at our opening reception on April 30th.And copies of this books will be available. So hopefully folks will feel as inspired as I was. So thank you for being part of Device Talks, Boston.

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Hey, thanks for the opportunity.

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So let's talk about first a little bit about you. Talk about your lab and some of the projects you worked on. People know you, of course, by name and your keynote and TED Talks and all that. But just give folks a little bit of a primer on Jeff Karp in your lab.

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Absolutely. So my laboratory is focused on the process of medical innovation. And really in the broadest sense, I see it as a continually evolving, iterative process that we're developing in the lab, that we're now applying to all kinds of

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different problems across the industry. And in particular, you know, unlike sort of traditional

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academia where the goal is to publish papers, our goal is to choose projects and really align projects and keep them aligned the whole distance so that we maximize potential to create new therapies, diagnostics, and other types of tools that could quickly be brought to patients. So some of the things that we've worked on include a surgical glue that we demonstrated could seal holes inside a beating heart and seal blood vessels. I co-founded a company a number of years ago called Tissium. It's based in Paris.And that company received regulatory approval for vascular reconstruction in Europe using this tissue glue.

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The glue, yeah, there's glue. It actually is a, it's biodegradable and it's elastic, also light curable.

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And we can tune the degradation of this material. It actually sort of infiltrates into the tissue. And then when we shine light onto it, light can go in, you know, tens of microns, 100 microns or so and cure the material inside the tissue. So it's almost like a tissue-like kind of Velcro interlock. And we're currently exploring this in a couple of clinical trials in Australia,one for nerve reconstruction and another for hernia repair. So that's, you know, one example that from the lab. We've also developed needles that can automatically stop in different layers of the eye

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to deliver gene therapy to the back of the eye to treat macular

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degeneration. So that's in the process of being advanced towards a trial.

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Company Myra therapeutics has a gene therapy. And they acquired a company that I co-founded

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bullseye therapeutics that had the needle. And, you know, they're moving that forward. Pudics that had the needle and, you know, they're moving that forward. And also have been working on a lot of different ways to deliver drugs to the body,

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including nanoparticles to target the brain for various neurological conditions and traumatic brain injury. And we're also developing drug delivery systems to treat osteoarthritis and cancer.

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So you've got a resume. We'll say that. I'm just curious, do you see, I mean, your lab and your success is based on science, but innovation itself, is innovation a science or an art or a mixture of both in your mind?

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I think innovation is really a mixture of both in your mind? I think innovation is really a mixture of both. I think there's just so many insights that we can gain along the way and the insights can help us to update that process. So I really see innovation as process driven and just many, many different considerations. So for example, let's say if, you know, typically in academia, if we're thinking of a problem, you know, we might think of the biology problem, you know, what's the target or we might think of sort of the medical problem, you know, what's the, you know, at the tissue level, what, what, what, you know, tissue's torn.It needs to be, you know, put back together. And, you know, we sort of think of it like that. What does the surgeon need to do to get the patient, you know, kind of on their way? But I think for innovation really to happen, we have to think broader than that. We need to think about, you know, kind of on their way. But I think for innovation really to happen, we have to think broader than that. We need to think about, you know, some of the translational aspects, including the patent problem. You know, if we can't get a patent, then we're unlikely to get investment or partnership, you know, with the companies that we need to, that we need to partner with to really gain the momentum. We also have to think about the clinical trial problem early in the process.So, you know, what are we going to compare to if this goes to a trial? And ideally, we want that to be part of our experiments early on as a way to define if we're on the right track can kind of help us to determine if our results are important. And then there's the manufacturing problem as well. You know, a lot of technologies coming out of bioengineering or biomedical labs just haven't made it to patientsbecause you can't manufacture it. And then, you know, there's the reimbursement problem and the practical application. And so I kind of see innovation as really almost like a Venn diagram, like overlapping circles. And all these domains, you really need to find the overlap. And in my lab, I've just found it incredibly useful to think about all of these right at the startand along, you know, the entire process. And I think it really helps to define a North Star for projects to keep us on track towards maximizing potential to, you know, to truly innovate. That's great.

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No, it's a great way to put it almost sounds like innovation sort of is the first gear to get moving forward. But all those other sciences and things are second, third, and fourth and fifth year is really, really get you to take off. So let's talk about the book because lit, I think it's, and again, it stands for life ignition tools. And for me, it really kind of seems,read as sort of a how-to for innovating new ideas. Not so much get a whiteboard, write things down, but more how to appreciate what's inside you and what's outside in the world and sort of connected to generate new ideas. How did you come to write this book lit?What was the inspiration behind writing a book about inspiration? Yeah.

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Well, an agent contacted me in New York, you know, seven, eight years ago. She had seen some of the work that we had published on bioinspiration, where we turned to nature for inspiration, you know, to bring fresh ideas into the lab and really to try to get our brains into this high-energy brain state, you know, where we do our best thinking. And I was really interested in writing a book on that topic, but there was something else that was really burning within me, which is when I was younger, I struggled a lot with undiagnosed ADHD and learning differences. And I really had to,for survival, develop tools that were, you know, coping mechanisms. And, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, I think, to use the tools to maximize connection with people, um, which has been incredibly

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helpful in my lab to, you know, I really try to create an environment to empower people

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because I think it just creates maximal optimism and really momentum in the most, you know,

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massive way, way possible. And as well, you know, I commit to being a mentor for life for

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everybody who enters my lab. So lit the tools really came out, not from my laboratory per se, but really from my life's laboratory. And I've been using them for both

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professional and personal development. So how did you decide to lay out the book or to write the book? It's written very much kind of in a, each chapter is more or less a lesson or a step. Did you, did you want it to be read that? Obviously, if you wrote it that way, you wanted to be read that way.

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But do you want this to be sort of a how-to for folks? How do you describe this book to someone if you're talking with them in someone's backyard at a barbecue? Well, you're exactly right.

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Each chapter is a tool. There are 12 tools altogether. And they're really simple set of holistic tools that you can either use one at a time or, you know, they work also together in kind of like a symphony. And the tools are designed to help us tap into a heightened state of awareness that we can bring to any moment or any situation and really to infuse fresh energy into our lives so that we can really take those steps forwardto be intentional and be deliberate and really identify, you know, what are the high value questions, for example, that we should be asking that can really lead us towards maximal impact. So, for example, one of the chapters is called Live for the Questions, and it's all about how we need a tool to fire up our neurons and our thinking and really help us to identify what's the best next step forward and to also help us identify what's the most important thing to focus on. So, for example, in the laboratory,one of the questions that I ask in every lab meeting is the following, what is the bar we need to exceed to get everybody excited? In other words, it's kind of like the so what question. It's what's the best result that anyone has ever achieved in a particular model and how much better do we need to do to really claim that we've moved the needle for the field? And to me, it's just such an important question to ask because it really helps us to focusour attention on impact. And when we do that, you know, when we go to submit our work to journals, it becomes much more easy to communicate the impact of what we've achieved or when we go present at conferences. But then also when we go talk to investors or, you know, we're trying to build an entrepreneurial team,the better we can convey the impact of what we've achieved, you know, the more likely we are to gain momentum and really, you know, move things forward in a major day. So, so questions are just so important, I think, in every area of our life.

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And we can even, you know, turn within to ask ourselves high value questions that can help us to identify roadblocks in maybe our thinking or to help us to reframe things so that we can make sense of certain situations and get ourselves out of ruts or, you know, sometimes we get hung up on certain things.

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And questions can help us get out of those ruts and on our way.

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That's interesting.

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I mean, we, I think we usually see or often see innovation as sort of an incremental crawl toward something.

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And you start here and you figure out how to take the next step and the next rock.

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To me, it sounds as if you're sort of inverting that and saying, this is where we want to be, set the destination first,

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and then trust that you're going to find each rock to get to that point that you've already identified.

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Exactly.

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Yeah.

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So we,

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I think that, you know, there certainly is, it's kind of like anything we do, let's say in the laboratory, there's a certain,'s kind of like anything we do, let's say, in the laboratory, there's a certain, there's certain elements of process that we have used previously that we can apply.

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But there's also a whole realm of new possibilities, new things, new ways that we need to think about things. You know, every project is completely different. And I think what really defines whether we're successful or, you know, every project is completely different. And, and I think what really defines whether we're successful or, you know, it can create momentum is really based on the questions we ask or the questions that we don't ask. And in fact, I'll give you a story when I started my, my laboratory, one of the first technologies that we developed was to take stem cells out of the body and manipulate them, modify them, so that we could infuse them into the bloodstream, just, you know, simple intravenous infusion and have them target any site. So you can imagine, you know, we might be able to treat, if we could target stem cellsto the bone and have them produce new bone, you know, we could treat osteoporosis. Or if we could target stem cells to the heart following a heart attack, we might be able to prevent the

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progression to heart failure. Or if we could target stem cells to the brain, you know, there's a whole

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variety of neurological conditions. And we were literally on the cusp of a major breakthrough. We had data demonstrating that we could actually do this. We could take stem cells out, manipulate them, and infuse them to target specific sites in the body. And I was so excited about this. I went to flagship ventures and to present. And,you know, I was certain that this was going to be a company and, and, you know, we'd be on our way. And, you know, it was one of these things where I couldn't sleep the night before. I was just so,

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so excited. I get in the next day. And, you know, I'm just really, you know, into it. I go through all the data. I'm almost like smirking because I just feel like, you know, I got this in the bag.

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And Nubar, the head of flagship, reaches over. And he says, Jeff, you know, this is really, really great. But we're going to take a pass. And I was like, what? It was like one of those moments where

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I couldn't really hear too much of what he was saying next, but he essentially said to me that

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what we were doing was just too complicated and that it was like a five-step process and we would need quality control at every step. And so even though, you know, the data was, was great, um, the process we had used was just far too complex and,

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um, would create too much manufacturing risk. And, um, so I went back to the lab. Um, and, uh, initially was really, really frustrated and kind of angry because this was, you know, I just started my lab and this was the first major project. You know, it worked about a year and a half on it and, you know, pretty much put all my resources into it.

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But as what happens, you know, kind of typically after a challenge or a failure, you know, the emotions subside after a day or two, kind of like one of these after the rain moments. And I, the insight started to pour in. And I realized that, wait a moment, here I am at the beginning of my career. And I could apply the insights that I just gained from the question I failed to ask, which is what happens next after something leaves the lab. And through this process, this concept of radical simplicity was born, which I really see as theart and discipline of minimizing complexity at all levels. And since that time, I've applied it to every project in the lab. And I think it's one of the reasons why pretty much every major project in the lab has turned into a company.

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That's fascinating.

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So, again, turning to the book lit, it stands for Life Ignition Tools, and it's out and it's available.

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You talk a lot about your connection to nature and how that inspires innovation, or at least

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put you in a place where innovation can occur. Can you expand on that a bit? Absolutely.

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So nature is just so incredible. I mean, so multifaceted. And there's just so much that we can learn from nature. and there's just so much that we can learn from nature. And I think that, you know, one, one, through one lens, when we look at nature, it's, you know, the environment is, is constantly changing.There's perturbations, you know, there's forest fires or meteors or volcanoes or, you know, there's all the trees that are falling down. And yet nature or weather changes. And nature is is experimenting constantly and adapting. And I think that there's a lot that we can learn from that. And then, you know, even a layer deeper is that everything in nature is interconnected. So, you know, for example, there's sub-millimeter creatures in the ocean, the phytoplankton,which are providing over half of the oxygen that we breathe on Earth. And, you know, it's not from the trees. It's actually from the phytoplankton in the ocean. And so just, you know, as we start to understand the interconnectedness of everything, we start to realize that, you know, our dependence on this interconnectedness, this interdependedness.And, and I think, you know, nature really thrives on biodiversity. And to me, so I've learned so many lessons from nature that have helped me to really construct my lab in a way to maximize our ability to achieve impact. And so one of the things that we do in the lab is minimize the overlap of expertise of people. So maximize the diversity of people in the lab. And it's not just to maximize diversity for the sake of it. It literally leads to different ways of thinking, different access to tools and knowledge. So for example, you know, we have in the lab atany given time, chemical engineers, mechanical engineers, electrical engineers, immunologists, basic biologists. We've had a gastrointestinal surgeon, a cardiac surgeon, we've had a dentist, and it's constantly changing. And so by minimizing the overlap, we're actually maximizing our potential to have access to, you know, reach into all kinds of different fields, the tools, the knowledge, the ways of thinking. And then we've had people from over 30 countries in the lab as well. And,you know, the education system is different in every country. And so people think a little bit differently. And I think that's also, you know, one of the reasons why we're able to, you know, make advances the way that that we have. The other thing about nature, um, is that I think nature doesn't have an end goal. Uh, nature is just constantly evolving and adapting. And when we think of the human kind of condition and how we lead our lives, we often set these goals and they feel like the end. You know, if we don't achieve the goal, we, we, you know, can get quite upset about it.And so this is also something that I think is really critical to consider as we advance in various projects is that sort of like the iterative nature, the iterative nature of nature

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and, you know, how we can actually bring that into our projects and really see that the goal is really gaining insights and improving and gaining insights and improving over time.

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I'll just give you an example. Recently, I got invited to give a talk at an innovation course at Stanford, you know, about six weeks ago or so. And I'd never given a talk on, on the book before. And so I went and I, you know, I prepared the talk, used all the processes that I, I have developed over the years for putting, you know, lectures together. And I went out there and I gave it. And, you know, I think it went well. It was, it was okay. But, you know, it wasn't like, I didn't hit it out of the park, right? And, but instead of sort of just jumping to self-shame, like I would do, let's say in the past, I was able to sort of say to myself, you know what, this is just generation 1.0. And there probably is going to be like a generation five and a generation 10 and maybe even ageneration 20. And so I kind of was able to focus my attention on the iterative kind of improvements and sort of notice parts of that lecture where I maybe wasn't connecting the way I wanted to. And so on the flight back, you know, I was able to make some tweaks to the slides, which then ends up being exciting because I know I'm going to be able to connect even more the next time I give that lecture. Interesting.

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So one other area I wanted to get into in the book.

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And again, the name of the book is lit.

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And I think it's timely that it's coming out now. I think it's probably a great gift for graduates, high school graduates, college graduates. It seems like that kind of book that helps folks set a path. In the book, and you've talked about this before, but in the book, you reference your childhood and your learning differences and how that sort of led to, well, to you building this career. Talk a bit about your, we don't need to cover your childhood in great detail,but what were some of the different approaches you had to learning as a child, and how has it helped you reach where you are? And again, folks can read about this also in the book.

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One of the greatest lessons that I learned as a child as I was sort of navigating, you know, these learning differences in ADHD was just how powerful attention is. And, you know, here this like super distracted kid, you know, I remember one day I actually got off the bus, I think was in the third grade. We had just moved out into the country. And my driveway was, you know, it's carved through a forest.And I was walking along the driveway and I saw a bat. And I had never seen a bat before. And it just amazed me how, you know, I would have almost be ruminating after I got off the bus of all the challenges that I kind of, you know, was just tired, exhausted and just all these different thoughts in my mind. And when I saw this bat, it was almost like it squeezed out all the other thoughts. I could only focus on the bat.

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And later on, I, in the evening, I started thinking, like, maybe I could bring this concept or this,

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this sort of power of being able to pinch out other thoughts from my brain so that I could focus on learning in school because I found it very difficult to kind of follow along. And so I learned to be able to pinch my brain to actually squeeze out other thoughts and essentially use my intention to focus my attention. And this is something that I've been doing kind of throughout life as a way to really maximize not just the information that is kind of processing in my mind, but also imprinting into my memory and then being able to recall it later and connect ideas and do lateral thinking, which is where I think a lot of the kind of creative, you know, problem solving and brainstorming, you know, tends to happen. And I think that, you know, all of us are capableof pinching our brains in this way and really refining our attention. It's, you know, it's our greatest resource, I think. And especially important in this digital and really refining our attention. It's our greatest resource, I think, and especially important in this digital age

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where we have all these algorithms

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and $900 billion of marketing and advertising

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every year that is going into hijacking our attention. So I think it's really important that we have ways and tools to develop this skill of focusing our attention on the things that, and you're really being deliberate about it. Is there a hack you can, you can share? I know

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at the end of the day, I find myself particularly, I have a hard time concentrating. I'll put some music on it. It kind of focuses my brain a bit and I'm able to get some work done. Is there anything you do in particular to give your brain a squeeze? Absolutely, absolutely.

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So one of the things that I do, and I've kind of found that there's a variety of things I can do during the day that are deceptively simple.

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But if I kind of make a practice out of it, it really helps to rewire my brain.

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In fact, it's important, I think, for everyone to consider that we have

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this incredible prefrontal cortex in our brain relative to the brain size. I think it's the largest

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in, you know, of all the animals. And then we also have, and that's where, you know, executive function is where we're, you know, consciously focusing our attention and problem solving and planning and, you know, thinking about thinking. And then we have this incredible ability to rewire our brains, you know, neuroplasticity. And so I think if we can find practices like the one I'm going to tell you in a moment, and, you know, there's lots of them, lots of possibilities and just kind of try to go back to it

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every day, you know, once or twice, we can start to use our prefrontal cortex to rewire our brains and then our attention improves. And so one of the really, really simple ways of doing this is, um, is really to tune into specific senses that we have.

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You know, our senses are how we experience the world. And our digital culture and the algorithms and, you know, all this advertising, it really flattens our senses. And so there's, I think,a goal of kind of resensitizing them. And so one of the things I do is at least one meal a day, if not all of them, I will really tune into the flavors and make that the intention. And so if I'm eating, you know, there's a tendency these days, I think, to have your phone and you're kind of scrolling, you're watching Netflix or whatever.And if you're doing that, your attention's really atomized because you're doing your multitasking. And so if you kind of set the intention to connect with the flavors in a meal, then you're moving away from multitasking and you're really sort of honing in on and laser focusing on a single sense. And so I found that to actually be really useful. And in fact, you can even before you eat,

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you can even like pause just for a moment to consider what the flavors might, like, you know, what the taste of everything might be of what you're

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about to eat. And that's another way, again, of sort of rewiring your brain to focus your

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attention on these specific senses. And to take that one step further, another really simple

Speaker 32020.6s - 2097.46s

thing, and I think, again, deceptively simple thing that we can do to improve our attention is as we walk outside, for example, we can, again, deceptively simple thing that we can do to improve our attention, is as we walk outside, for example, we can cycle through our senses. So what I mean by that is we can walk around our neighborhoods and say, for example, I do this all the time, I say sight, and I'll look at the texture of the bark on the trees, and I'll look at the texture of the bark on the trees and I'll look at the tops of the trees and I'll look at the clouds and and then I'll say hearing and I'll just listen for the birds and I'll listen for the rustling of the wind and the leaves or you know and then I'll say touch and I'll feel my heelshit the ground and my toes and I'll feel the clothes against my skin and the wind hit my face. And essentially what I'm doing is resensitizing my senses by focusing individually on each one, you know, one at a time. And these simple practices have really helped me to focus my attention. You know, another simple thing I do as well is, let's say if I'm driving in the car, there's a tendency for me to just turn on the radio, put on a podcast. You know, I just almost just instantaneously, you know, habitually just reach for the button, you know.

Speaker 52097.56s - 2099.86s

Well, I'm glad as a podcaster, I think you should.

Speaker 22099.98s - 2102.04s

I think I'm going to cut this part of the interview up.

Speaker 52102.08s - 2102.82s

No, just kidding. Continue.

Speaker 22104.26s - 2166.52s

So what I do from time to time is I just pause. Like I press pause and I just sort of see what happens. And what typically will happen is if I press pause, that sensation kind of fades, but then it comes back, you know, like a minute later. And it's like I feel the urge. I got to listen to something.And then I let that sort of dissipate again and then it happens again and what happened what I found is about three times if I can resist sort of that that impulse like just by pressing pause then I eventually become comfortable with just my own thoughts and sort of looking out the window and paying attention to driving or you know and, I feel like that's, to me, what intentionality is all about. It's about these little things in our day where we canfocus our attention and be very deliberate about it. And by doing, making a practice of that, we're able to rewire our brains and be able to then use that as a tool

Speaker 52166.52s - 2213.16s

to pay attention to anything that we want. That's fantastic. I think that's great advice. I think it's a great tease of what's in the book. Again, the book is called Lit. That stands for Life Ignition Tools. Use Nature's Playbook to energize your brain, spark ideas, and ignite, action. So we'll have you at Device Talks, Boston. Again, you'll be the opening reception, which is happening on April 30th, from 5 to 7.We'll have a table set up where folks can buy this book. But as I said up top, folks who use the code that we gave, the first 10, we'll get a book for free, and folks can buy copies there as well. And I imagine you'll be signing if people ask. Absolutely.

Speaker 22213.36s - 2213.94s

Be happy too.

Speaker 52214.24s - 2236.74s

I think it would be a great commencement gift, graduation gift for someone. Lots of, what I really liked about is you read it, and it's very familiar. It's almost intuitive. You're like, oh, I could do that, and I could do read it and it's very familiar. It's almost intuitive. You're like, oh, I could do that and I could do that and I could do that. I think it's very approachable and very helpful. So well done.Very nice book. Thanks for putting that together. Hey, thank you.

Speaker 22236.8s - 2240.34s

Thanks again for having me on your show and I've enjoyed this conversation. Me too.

Speaker 52240.44s - 2299.1s

We'll see you at Device Talks, Boston. All right, great. It's great conversation with Jeff Karp. Really looking forward to see you at Device Talks, Boston. Up recording. All right, great. It's a great conversation with Jeff Karp. Really looking forward to having him at Device Talks, Boston's opening reception. Make sure you register using the code. Lit 25.You'll not only save 25%, which is almost a couple hundred bucks, but you also get a free copy of Lit signed by Jeff Karp himself. And he'll be there to share stories, to talk about the book, to talk about other things that he's working on, which are a lot of amazing things as you heard. So a great opportunity to meet one of Biomed's better innovators. So with that, I'd like to bring in our podcast sponsor, Foydenberg Medical. I'm speaking with Paul Weifer. Paul is the director of product development at Foydenberg Medical. I'm speaking with Paul Weifer.Paul is the director of product development at Fruidenberg Medical. Paul, welcome. Tell us about Fruidenberg Medical and we're going to be talking a lot about electrophysiology.Talk about what you do in the space. Yeah, hi, Tom.

Speaker 02299.2s - 2357.48s

Thanks for the introduction. And I'm delighted to be joining you and your listeners on today's podcast. So at Freudenberg Medical, we are a global partner to medical device OEMs for product design, development and manufacturing. This includes medical components and tubing to drug and device solutions and finished devices.We have 11 locations worldwide located in all the key MedTac clusters globally. We've been supporting leading players in the EP devices market for over 15 years at this point, partnering on a range of product solutions from steerable access devices through to ablation and visualization catheters. Our specific design and volume manufacturing capabilities for the EP market is supported from five of our sites in three continentswith a combined footprint of now over 400,000 square feet. And we're obviously very proud to be a trusted outsourcing partner to our customers for their EP product portfolios. That's really fascinating, Paul.

Speaker 52357.48s - 2363.54s

So what are some of the unique design and manufacturing challenges associated with EP devices?

Speaker 02364.28s - 2457.64s

Well, Tom, I think there are two that come to mind. Firstly, Casseter steering. So when EP procedures, we're navigating the intricate left side of the heart, which is a constantly dynamic tree structure. So for physicians and engineers alike, precision steering is essential. We're strategizing how to maneuver through the atrium,avoid delicate structures, and prevent catheter misplacement for the best patient outcome. This is where multi-planar, catheter and handle steering mechanisms, and their associated design nuances step in. The second key challenge is probably around real estate management within the catheter. So for context, most EP caceters are about half the diameter of a small point pen, yet we're cramming them with more and more technology now. Alongside steering mechanisms,we could be incorporating energy delivery systems, sensors, optics and irrigation functions. The question is, how do we fit us all in? One main answer lies in cutting edge designed for manufacturing. Take, for instance, the shift in cable management from individual electrode wires to flexible PCBs and flex circuits along the catheter shaft. There's not only streamlines the assembly process, but also enhances performance and reliability. So in essence, Tom, I feel the Caster Engineering Community is rising to the occasion with remarkable ingenuity and incremental innovations.And despite unique challenges, we're continuously pushing boundaries with our customers to revolutionize

Speaker 52457.64s - 2571.78s

patient care. All right, we'll hear more from Paul Weifer a little later in the podcast. If you want to find out more about Freudenberg Medical, go to its website. Freudenbergmedical.com. And Freudenberg is spelled, F-R-E-U-D-E-N-B-E-R-G.Freudenbergmedical.com. Next up, I'd like to give a little bit of preview of who will be speaking at Device Talks, Boston. In this next clip, it's a conversation I had with Scott Nelson, who's a CEO of FastWave, which is one of the intravascular lithotrispy companies that we'll be talking to. Of course, Shockwave sort of created this space, or at least created the application that they're using.They're being acquired by Jay &J's. We'll see how that turns out. And that's going to leave a couple of companies, at least in this space. One of them will be Fast Wave. The other one will be ABS, Amplitude Vascular Systems, and both will be at Device Talks, Boston. And I'll be leading a conversation with Scott Nelson and Sean Gilligan of AVS.So I spoke with Sean about two months ago. So there's just a quick overview of Fast Wave. We, of course, had him on the podcast a few months ago, but I just wanted to give him a chance to, again, tell a fast wave story and give a little preview of what's coming up at Device Talks, Boston. Let's listen.Hey, everybody. Tom Salemi here from Device Talks. We're talking about our agenda at Device Talks, Boston, which is happening on May 1st and 2nd at the Boston Convention and Exhibition Center. I'm really enjoying the opportunity to meet with some of our speakers prior to the meeting and to help them share their stories with you. And I'm particularly happy to have Scott Nelson, the CEO of Fast Wave Medical here today. Scott, thanks for joining us in this discussion.

Speaker 42572.66s - 2577.08s

Yeah, thanks for having me, Tom. Really looking forward to this chat, but also device talks come early May.

Speaker 52577.24s - 2611.14s

No, I love Device Talks, Boston, and Device Talks, of course. But Device Talks, Boston is my hometown conference. But what I like about MedTech and I like about device talks is we try to really identify the problems in the healthcare industry that MedTech folks are trying to solve. And the MetTech industry is all about targeting those problems, those bottlenecks, those weak spots in the industry and creating new devices to solve them and to treat patientsand to streamline the operation. So I'll get off my soapbox to talk about Fastwave, but the whole topic excites me. So what is a particular problem that Fastwave medical

Speaker 42611.14s - 2632.66s

is trying to solve? Yeah, we're designing and developing intravascular lithopsy system. So the acronym that's often used, at least within the cardiovascular space, is IVL. And so the best sort of analogy that I often like to kind of refer to is plumbing, right? So most of those folks that are listening to this have probably dealt with some sort of blockage

Speaker 32632.66s - 2638.04s

in a pipe. In some cases, Drano, you know, simple drano will work. In other cases, the blockage

Speaker 42638.04s - 2643.06s

is too severe, too complex, and you need to call in a plumber. And sort of the plumbers in our

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case are interventional cardiologists and vascular

Speaker 42645s - 2678.18s

surgeons. And oftentimes they're utilizing a tool set, right? A tool bag of various modalities. Some of those include angioplasty, stents, I think, or scaffolding is probably the best way to think as fenced. And a threctomy is another kind of technology as well. But IVL is part of that tool bag, right? And it's a, it's a newer category kind of in the space, but has proven to be especially useful when treating complex blockages or complex calcium, whether it's in the legs or in the heart. Interesting. So IVL is a

Speaker 52678.18s - 2695.6s

space that was developed by a startup. It's a true startup story. Shockwave developed it, developed the IVL system. Uh, so they're, they're, they're out there in the market now. What is, what is fast wave doing that's a bit different? What is the, the, the solution that you're bringing to this problem? Yeah. And to your

Speaker 42695.6s - 2703.88s

point, shockwave has done an incredible job, right, in creating this category, right, applying, or taking technology that we've known for decades, an extracorporeal lithorchipsy for, for kidney

Speaker 02703.88s - 2723.42s

stones and, and sort of applying that inside angioplasty balloons. And so they've done a phenomenal job of not only creating a category, but executing commercially. That said, there's some kind of some clear gaps that a lot of physicians would like to see addressed. And maybe even kind of zooming out a little bit,

Speaker 32723.72s - 2729.88s

a lot of physicians just want to see more options, more IVL options to choose from. And so some of those gaps that we're trying

Speaker 02729.88s - 2752.48s

to solve for with Fast Wave and the systems that we're developing are longer length balloons, right, to treat long, diffuse disease, balloons that are a little bit more crossable and easier to traverse and navigate through complex calcium. In addition, oftentimes physicians that are treating, treating heavily diseased vessels want more energy pulses to work with. And so that's

Speaker 52752.48s - 2774.76s

another area that we're focused on at fast wave. Interesting. So where is fast wave in your development? And how do you, as a startup, I mean, again, MedTech is all about startups taking on bigger challenges. Maybe there's already players in the space, as there is in this case. What's fast waves planned for the next couple of years? And how do you see yourself engaging in the market? Yeah.

Speaker 42775.3s - 2781.38s

We're a reasonably young company, right? I mean, we started the company officially formed in in early 21.

Speaker 02781.54s - 2820.04s

It's made some pretty nice progress since then. So raised almost 20 million to date. We've got a number of patents under our belts and have moved quite rapidly, I would say, and actually just recently completed our first in human studies in the periphery and are now focused on moving forward into pivotal trials in the periphery and then early stage clinical work in the coronaries as well. So one of the things that we're trying to optimize for at Fast Wave is obviously not onlyaddressing some of the gaps that I mentioned previously, but also executing against those quickly and efficiently and in a fast, you know, pun intended fast sort of fashion.

Speaker 52820.04s - 2834.28s

And so that's one of the things that probably sets us apart as a company. Fantastic. Well, I'm looking forward to having your story told at Device Talks, Boston. You'll be on a panel on IVL. And I'm really grateful you took a few minutes today to share your story and to be part of this conversation.

Speaker 42834.9s - 2848.48s

Yeah, appreciate the opportunity. Thanks again, Tom. And really looking forward to Devise Talks, Boston in early May. All right. It was great to talk to Scott Nelson of Fastwave.

Speaker 52853.44s - 2876.54s

Once again, he'll be on a panel that I'm moderating on May 1st at Device Talks, Boston. Go to Boston.com to register and to check out the agenda. Now we'll bring back our sponsor, Freudenberg Medical. Once again, I'm here with Paul Weifer. Paul is Director of Product Development at Freududenberg Medical. Once again, I'm here with Paul Weifer. Paul is Director of Product Development at Freudenberg Medical. Paul, we're going to be talking about Pulse Field Ablation a little more in this podcast episode. Can you tell me about your experiences so far in Pulse Field Ablation?

Speaker 02877.28s - 2952.6s

Yes, well, the race is very evident, Tom. As your listeners will know, all the large EP players are highly active with multiple PFA designs in the mix, some already successfully on the market. Add to that, the estimated dozen or more small and mid-sized companies also eyeing the PFA opportunity. So certainly it makes for an exciting and competitive landscape. That said, we see many of these players looking to specialist external partners like Freidenberg Medical to accelerate the pace of casserousment and more crucially, provide turnkey ability to scale manufacturing of these casserers to high volume. There is a keen focus on reliability, previous experience with PFA caceters and the ability of the partner to always hit critical timelines. And it's important to note it's not just about the PFA caceters that are the focus of development.There are complementary enabling devices for access, steering and visualization which must also be considered. Freudmark Medical is proud to be an active partner in PFA and equally as proud of the contribution we have made so far to help pioneering customers claim firsts in the market.

Speaker 52953.76s - 2980.74s

Great stuff, Paul Weifer. We'll have Paul Weifer, Foydenberg Medical, back a little later in this podcast episode. Once again, if you'd like to find out more information about the company, go to its website, Freudenbergmedical.com. Now, let's listen to the conversation I had with Rebecca Seidel. She's president of cardiac ablation solutions at Medtronic. Well, Rebecca Seidel, welcome to the podcast.

Speaker 12981.12s - 2985.06s

Hi, Tom. Great to see you again. Great to see you as well. You were one of our

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original guests on the Medtronic Talks podcast, so we're welcome you back in a way, but this is your first time, I think, on our Device Talks Weekly podcast. So great to have you. Indeed. Thank you.

Speaker 12996.18s - 3001.46s

And a great topic, too. So much going on. So I don't think we got into a little bit on the Medtronic

Speaker 53001.46s - 3010.44s

talks podcast, but since it's a separate podcast, let's take it from the top. What's your path into the MedTech industry? How did you find your way? Yeah.

Speaker 13010.56s - 3042.3s

So I started as an electrical engineer a million years ago, and that's really how I got interested in the science. When I came over to Medtronic, I started in a customer service area, which was an exciting place to be for certain, but I quickly fell in love with electrophysiology and have had a few different roles in that space. But it's super exciting. It's one of those places that continues to innovate over and over. And I think because,you know, atrial fibrillation is a progressive disease, there's always more to do and more to think about to make it a better treatment for patients.

Speaker 53043.3s - 3045.72s

And what was your first job in MedTech?

Speaker 13046.2s - 3065.38s

Yeah, my first job in MedTech was actually on a customer service line and also installing systems. And so a field service type job where I think I learned a lot from physicians and learned a lot from what we did right and what we did wrong and how we could really delight or, you know, sometimes disappoint. And so that

Speaker 33065.38s - 3071.5s

really resonated with me that what we do and when we get things right, it really, really

Speaker 53071.5s - 3081.56s

matters for patients. And you mentioned your love of electrophysiology. It is an intriguing feel. What is it about the, what are the qualities of electrophysiology that really appeal to you?

Speaker 13082.1s - 3106.78s

Yeah, I think the interesting thing about electrophysiology is the science that's necessary in order to really think about how do you treat a patient. So, as I said, it's a progressive disease. And, you know, what fits for one patient may not fit for all patients. So the conversations that we have with physicians, the way we continue to innovate is what's really exciting to me.Excellent.

Speaker 53107.3s - 3131.08s

So let's talk about pulse field ablation, which is the talk of the day. Metronic was one of the, had the first product approved by the FDA. We can get into those particulars in a moment. But if you wouldn't just mind taking a moment and just giving us an understanding of what pulse field depletion is and how it differs from other ablative technologies. Yeah.

Speaker 13131.22s - 3163.1s

So pulse field ablation is really the third energy source in the mix for a.F ablation. So we've had cryotechnology, RF technology, and now pulse field ablation. The interesting thing about pulse field ablation is it really has selective tissue capability. And so what that means is when you're only ablating cardiac myocytes, you may not ablate other tissues around. So esophagus or other things that could cause complications. And I think that's the real excitement and enthusiasm about this technology.It could be safer.

Speaker 33163.62s - 3191.2s

And all the evidence is showing that it will be safer and it could be even faster. So those are the things that make it really interesting and exciting. How is it able to affect some tissue but not others? Yeah, it's a good question. And I think, you know, primarily because of the waveform that we're using with pulse field ablation, it has the sensitivity to really just go after cardiac myocytes.

Speaker 13191.2s - 3195.14s

Every single company has a different waveform that they're using for pulse field ablation.

Speaker 53195.34s - 3198.12s

So one PFA, maybe just one PFA.

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And we're working to fine tune those waveforms in order to ensure we get the best result.

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And we'll take a quick break from this conversation for one final visit from our friends at

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Freudenberg Medical.

Speaker 53213.6s - 3231.22s

Once again, I am speaking with Paul Weaver. Paul is the director of product development at Freudenberg Medical. Paul, as an outsourcing partner, do you see any new or additional challenges in pulse field ablation devices over and above, say, the traditional RF or cryoblation designs?

Speaker 03232.24s - 3320.68s

Well, that's an interesting question, Tom. If I reflect on first generation PFA devices, we are seeing a blend of built for purpose and repurposed designs. So I think as we transition into the next phase, we anticipate the shift towards more purposeable designs, which will undoubtedly introduce fresh design opportunities and complexities. So from the perspective of a catheter engineer, as we work through these second generation devices,the evidence of real-world data will be instrumental in guiding future design trajectories in PFA. I believe establishing gold standards, particularly regarding energy delivery techniques, such as single shot, focal or point-by-point approaches, the shape of the electrical field and waveform, all of these factors will be pivotal. The nuances between unipolar and bipolar energy delivery and the necessity for mapping remains an open question.So it wouldn't surprise me, Tom, to witness the eventual dominance of a hybrid device, amalgamating various energy modalities or mapping techniques into a single device, potentially packing even more technology into the one catheter. So while we do this, we also need to figure out how do we keep sheet profiles low for easy handling and maneuverability. I believe as PFA matures, it will certainly present novel challenges as is typical of any emerging therapy. But at Freudberg Medical, working with our customers, we are relishing and embracing these challenges head on.

Speaker 53321.4s - 3333.28s

All right, Paul, a final question, a little bit of a challenging one. If you had to condense your experiences with PFA so far into just three words, what would those three words be? Great question, Tom.

Speaker 03333.72s - 3339.2s

I think the first would be excitement, second pace, and the third expertise.

Speaker 53340.26s - 3355.98s

So excitement, because of the transformative potential at PFA holds, in a lot of ways it's akin to the excitement surrounding breakthroughs like drug-alluding stents and Tavi. PFA is a new kid on the block, which is getting a lot of attention, so there's excitement when you are contributing to that.

Speaker 03356.88s - 3387.92s

We know PACE is crucial in this highly competitive race to the market, and everyone aims for that first mover advantage, but obviously not everyone can attain it. And finally, expertise is essential. In this fast evolving field, outsource partners must offer unparallel EP credentials and a strong track record if they are to guide a customer's program on a successful and streamlined path to market. All right, that's great stuff. Thank you, Paul Weifer, for joining us on this podcast episode.

Speaker 53388.36s - 3418.1s

Thank you, Foydenberg, for sponsoring this episode. Once again, if you'd like to find out more information about Foydenberg Medical, go to its website, phoenbergmedical.com. That's F-R-E-U-D-E-N-B-E-R-G-M-E-R-G-Medical.com. So let's talk about your pipeline. Let's start with Pulse Field Select.Give us a sense of your offerings,

Speaker 13418.46s - 3432.42s

and then we can sort of move into some of the newer additions centered around Pulse Field Ablation. Yeah, absolutely. So we're really proud to have the first Pulse field ablation technology approved in the U.S. market, and that is the Pulse Select technology.

Speaker 03432.72s - 3437.84s

This particular technology has been built from the ground up in order to really suit

Speaker 13437.84s - 3468.08s

pulse field ablation for patients. I would say that we built this product internally. We also have an external product called the Farah that we acquired. But if you go back to Pulse Field Ablation and Pulse Select, we spend about 10 to 15 years really working on the basic science of Pulse Field Ablation, learning about homilocyst, learning about the proper waveform,learning about safety features, and the team is really, really proud of that work.

Speaker 33469.08s - 3471.1s

We've done over the last 10 to 15 years.

Speaker 03471.18s - 3477.16s

Mark Stewart, who was our key scientist on this technology, had the really key paper that was

Speaker 13477.16s - 3515.6s

acknowledged by HRS around the basics of pulse field oblation. So that's where we started. We also decided that because that technology is a PBI technology, that we also needed a focal catheter, and that's why we purchased the Affaira system. So that system was purchased more than a year ago.It's on market in Europe, and it's getting really, really strong positive feedback for a focal wide area footprint catheter, included with a mapping system. So it's unique. It's a catheter that delivers pulse field ablation.It delivers RF. And it's a mapping catheter as well. So it's super unique and differentiated in the market.

Speaker 53517.32s - 3521.86s

What's the function of the mapping, the mapping catheter? What is it actually map? What is it doing?

Speaker 13522.08s - 3530.26s

Yeah. So the mapping catheter allows the physician to see where you are in the heart and where signals are in the heart. So it gives them basically the guidance

Speaker 53530.26s - 3535.94s

that they need to go in a blade a patient where they want to and when they want to. So it's really their roadmap.

Speaker 13537.38s - 3537.8s

Interesting.

Speaker 53538.6s - 3546.54s

So the acquisition as you said was a year ago, so this is now what the Sphere 360 is?

Speaker 13546.76s - 3549.96s

So it's that product. Yeah, so it's the Sphere 9 product.

Speaker 53550.42s - 3553.72s

So that product is available in Europe now.

Speaker 13553.86s - 3577.32s

We will have the results of the U.S. I.D. trial coming up at H.RS in May. So that's the Sphere 9 catheter. We also have a second platform called Sphere 360, which we just released some first in human results at ERA. And those results were excellent and we're really excited about the future of that technology. And we'll begin an IDE trial coming up with that catheter as well.

Speaker 53578.02s - 3603.4s

So how does your portfolio align around these multiple pulse field depletion tools? Are they going to be complementary? Are they going to be used ultimately when they're all in the market? I know they aren't right now. But how does the strategy play out for having a portfolio with so many, with three PFA devices? And I'm counting three.Maybe there's more. Maybe I'm missing one. How does this all play out?

Speaker 13603.4s - 3665.98s

Yeah. So there are really two pretty unique segments in the market. One is the PBI or likely for earlier patients and the other is a focal catheter. That's about 85% of the market. The PBI is 15% of the market. And so if you look at our PULC select catheter, that plays in that more 15% of the market space.And the sphere 9 catheter plays in the focal space. So distinct markets that have been really out there for a very, very long time. So we believe that they're complementary products. Now, when you bring 360 into the space, that catheter is connected into the mapping and navigation system. And so that will be utilized with the AFARA system. The Pulse Select catheter is available for use and is a more open platform that could be used on any mappingand navigation system. So today, we believe that there's a place for all of those technologies. I think the market will tell us, but what we're really proud of is the fact that we have technologies available across the entire scope of what an EP may want. And so it's up to them to choose.

Speaker 03666.34s - 3669.16s

So in the past, we had one catheter with cryo.

Speaker 33669.28s - 3672.06s

So our strategy was to really be more broad.

Speaker 03672.36s - 3676.22s

And we believe we're there with products that we have on the market today.

Speaker 13676.84s - 3679.62s

So where does cryo fit into all of this?

Speaker 53679.74s - 3685.76s

Does it get replaced by PFA? Is it still a useful energy source for this? What happens?

Speaker 13685.9s - 3712.44s

Yeah, I think we're seeing a number of, you know, projections out there in the marketplace about, you know, in five years, will PFA be 50% of the market? I think the market is yet to tell us the answer to that question. But if I look at cryo, you know, it has really, really strong efficacy results when, you know, we do redo ablations. We see the veins are silent in those patients.And so I think that that technology has a place for the long term, just given its efficacy

Speaker 53712.44s - 3729.2s

and safety over time. So how is the market responding to the arrival of PFA? How are the electrophysiologists that you're dealing with? Is it something that they're hungry for, that they're sort of want to see it prove out a bit more before they embrace it. What's the reaction, Ben?

Speaker 13729.34s - 3757.3s

Yeah, I think in any technology, you always have the early adopters and, you know, the late adopters. I will say with PFA, I think it's moving a bit more quickly to, you know, early adopters and then into the next phase. There is high enthusiasm for the Pulse Select catheterer in the Affair Catheters by many, many physicians, I would say, are very excited to get started. And the results that we're seeing and the feedback that we're getting on these catheters has also been really, really strong.So we're proud of what we've done here.

Speaker 53757.6s - 3772.96s

So, Rebecca, it's honestly getting hard to sort of keep track of all that's going on in this sector between the various companies that have programs. How does Metronix sort of view the future of this sector with the various catheters and the players? And how does this sort of all play out?

Speaker 13774.8s - 3819.6s

So as I think about the future of this particular space, it's a broad space and it continues to grow. So we haven't seen a slowdown in the growth of the market in, you know, several years here, which I think is a really important point. The second piece is the catheters that we've developed here, both internally and through acquisition, really fit the entire space of what patients may want, whether that's first-line therapy, whether that's persistent therapy.We have the tool set to make that happen. Now, certainly, there will be continued study and evidence that's going to, you know, continue to progress the market. And like I said, I think our catheters are well positioned in any of the space across the EP portfolio.

Speaker 53820.96s - 3833.92s

Are there additional, is there new innovations that are coming on? Is there going to be something already planned for post-pulse field depletion that you're looking at? Or is post-field depletion for the time being the novel new technology we'll be hearing about?

Speaker 13834.08s - 3842.62s

Yeah, I think, you know, many of us, many companies and, you know, of course, Medtronic for the longest year, have been working on PFA. And I think the future really is now.

Speaker 03843.26s - 3846.2s

And there's a lot of excitement and enthusiasm.

Speaker 33846.2s - 3850.92s

Just like other technologies, we're going to continue to need to create clinical evidence and

Speaker 03850.92s - 3857.44s

prove out which catheters, you know, are the best and how do we do dosing strategies. How do we,

Speaker 13857.52s - 3881.86s

how do we manage, you know, the opportunity for patients? But I think there are also, you know, like EP, the thing I mentioned at the outset, it's an exciting place to be. So what about AI and what about being able to select patients through other means versus just when you're in the lab? So I think there's more to come, but really there's a lot to talk about today with BFA.

Speaker 53883.2s - 3894.9s

Is there any opportunities for pulse field ablation to be used in places other than the heart or isn't exclusively, is this its primary function or can it be used to ablate tissue elsewhere in the body?

Speaker 13895.3s - 3905.54s

Yeah, Pulsefield ablation has been used for years in some cancer treatment. So we're not the first to use PFA. I think there are plenty of opportunities for it to be used outside of the heart.

Speaker 53905.64s - 3942.64s

I'm not the expert there, but I suspect that we'll see PFA used in many different ways in the future. And just, I'm sorry, I just want to drill down one more on perhaps broadening the market. What patients today under Cryo maybe weren't, they weren't advised to undergo ablation. Was it, was it patients who perhaps were sicker or, or what kept someone from getting, getting, going to electrophysiologist and being treated prior to PFA? And I'd like to understand how PFA potentially could change that.Yeah.

Speaker 13942.74s - 3975.04s

What I would say is the evidence around ablation in general has become much, much stronger for patients to get an ablation earlier. So our cryo first line study was a really important study that helped to drive guidelines to say ablation and cryo specifically should be done earlier. And so I think part of the transition to getting to more patients was done before PFA came along. But I think that's given physicians, cardiologists, patients even much more confidence to get an ablation earlier.

Speaker 33975.52s - 3977.78s

I think the other point here is safety.

Speaker 13978.34s - 3991.58s

When you know you're not going to have a really difficult safety event, it's going to make patients much more open-minded to getting inflation earlier. And I think with the new technologies, we're seeing that coming forward as well. Excellent.

Speaker 53991.88s - 3998.82s

All right. Well, there's much happening. I'm sure we'll be touching base again. Rebecca Seidel, thank you for joining us in the podcast.

Speaker 13999.1s - 4003.72s

Thank you so much, Tom. All right, well, that is a wrap.

Speaker 54003.72s - 4152.96s

Thanks again to Freudenberg, medical, for sponsoring this episode of Device Talks Weekly. Thank you to our guests. Rebecca Seidel at Medtronic, got Nelson of Fastwave and Jeff Karp, of course, the author of Litt.If you want to get a copy of LIT, register for Device Talks, Boston, and use the code Lit 25. You'll save money, and you'll have the opportunity to save, I'm sorry, to receive a free copy. The first 10 folks to do that will receive a free copy. The first 10folks to do that will receive a free copy of the book. But Jeff Karp will be at our opening reception on April 30th with a bunch of books to buy and he'll be there to talk to you and talk about innovation and talk about biomedical research and talk about all the cool stuff. He's a, he's a highly sought after keynote. He's on TED Talks. He's got a lot of great achievements behind him. So a great person to connect with at Device Talks, Boston. And TED Talks. He's got a lot of great achievements behind him. So a great person to connect with at Device Talks, Boston. And Device Talks, Boston, once again, is happening May 1stand 2nd at the Boston Convention on Exhibition Center. You definitely need to be there. Don't wait any longer, giving you an opportunity to save money, giving you an opportunity to meet a great author, giving you an opportunity to maybe win a free book. I don't know what else I can do other than just say you're going to regret not being there. So please join us at Device Talks, Boston. Regarding the podcast, please share this episode on social media. If you haven't already, please subscribe to the Device Talks podcast network. So you don't miss any of our future episodes of Device Talks Weekly, but our othergreat podcasts as well, including a couple of new ones that are coming out. So subscribe and any major podcast player to the Device Talks Podcast Network. And speaking of LinkedIn, please connect with me on LinkedIn, Tom Salemi, at Device Talks. You can also connect with Chris Newmarker, editor-in-chief at MassDevice, and Kaeline Brown, our managing editor at Device Talks. You could also follow Device Talks on LinkedIn, subscribe to our YouTube channel. You've got a lot of great content coming out your way.Lots of great ways to receive it. So please be part of Device Talks. But most immediately, please register now for Device device talks, Boston. Thank you to everyone who already has. Thank you again, everyone who's creating the great buzz about the event. It's very exciting. And, uh, thanks once more to Scott Nelson for the Jonathan Papelban shout out. That was, uh, that was really cool. Anyway, all right, folks. Uh, thank you for listening to this episode of the Device Talks Weekly podcast. We'll have anotherepisode coming to you next week. It'll be the final episode before our big event. And I really hope I get to see you in Boston. Take care, everybody.